Faith and Reason in Islam and the Religions

[Jeff]

What is faith? What is reason? How do they relate to each other when religious questions are involved? These are some of the fascinating questions religious thinkers deal with.

One of the most respected classic Sunni Islamic theologians is Abū Ḥāmid Muḥammad ibn Muḥammad al-Ghazālī (1058-1111). In his great work Ihya ulum al-din ("The Revival of Religious Sciences") in the section called 'The Proof of Islam”, he wrote the following:



The hajj is the most irrational thing in Islam. There we perform gestures and rites that are absolutely irrational. For this reason the hajj is the place where we can, better than in any other place, demonstrate our faith because reason does not understand anything at all of it and only faith makes us do those actions. Blind obedience to God is the best evidence of our Islam.

Volume 1, Book 7, Chapter 3, Section 2 (Cairo, 1939), 272ff.

What's your idea of how this represents Islam? Do you agree or disagree with it? Or agree in part, disagree in part?

(To be fair, there are strands of Catholic thought that have a similar flavor. The great early Father of the Church Tertullian famously said, Credo quia absurdum est, I believe it because it is absurd.)

[Seniora]

We can start with the defination of FAITH.. how is it defined?

1. Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.
2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.
3. Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
5. The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
6. A set of principles or beliefs.

If u reason something out, then that is not faith, its logic.

Next, i would ask myself, what is the role of faith in Religion?
I believe, u can associate urself with any religion, because that certain religion reasons things out better.. or because that religion is more "logical".
But u will not truly believe in that religion, unless u believe in the destination that religion (which can be looked upon as a path) takes u to.

Each religion takes you to one destination - The Higher Being, The One, The Almighty.
No amount of logic in the world can describe that Destination. Only Faith can make u reason out "His Almighty", as well as understand what is needed from us.

So yes, after explaining the above i believe that "Blind obedience to God, is the best evidence of Islam"

If u have faith (try substituting the word faith, with defination no, 2) in God, and in the religion that leads u to God, then u'll have no problem with BLIND OBEDIENCE, because whatever u do in Blind Obedeince to God, can never be bad, or harmful, thats the whole point of Faith, and thats the whole point of Islam... To have enough faith TO SUBMIT to THE ONE.

[Jeff]

^^
Very interesting, Seniora! :)

I liked this sentence especially:

"But u will not truly believe in that religion, unless u believe in the destination that religion (which can be looked upon as a path) takes u too."

[Threadlike]

I remember my father used to talk to me about faith as a child and he always referred to hajj as an example. As Ghazzali so brilliantly points out, it is a matter that is full of irrational things. It cannot be reasoned or logically accepted and is subject only to the extent of the faith.

I think faith is an inner notion of sort that prompts us generally towards good and towards the recognition of a Creator through that. We say the Islamic faith of monotheism is a general fitra. There is never really a perfect translation of fitra except perhaps instinct or intuition. Being born with this notion side-by-side with the capability of logical thinking is what separates us from any other creature of the Earth.

And I think that, in Islam, we believe that God demands from us to use our brains. To think, discover, understand and explore. As the great Islamic thinker and author Dr. Moustafa Mahmoud (may he rest in peace) once said, 'We must embark on a journey to discover nature and the universe around us because God SAID, 'Walk upon the Earth and see how I started Creation'' (Dr. Moustafa was referring to verse 20 of Surat al Ankaboot, Chapter 29).

I wish Moustafa Mahmoud had some translated episodes of his famous series Al Elm wa al Eeman (Science and Faith). I'm frankly not sure if they're available translated. The program was broadcast for a long time in the 90s and up to the early 2000s. It was a fascinating blend of science, nature and religion from one of the greatest minds ever to come out of Egypt. He died just a few days ago and all of Egypt mourned him, may he rest in peace. It takes a long, long time until we get minds like his.

[DODY]

in Allah we trust , arent we :)

[El Rey]

I don't see what's irrational about Hajj. Everything has a meaning starting from clothing.

I believe faith is deep internal love towards something or someone and this love is backed up with trust.

In religion, on the other hand, things don't have to be rational cos we already believe and experienced rational things which used to be irrational and we already believe in the creator Allah. When we believe in something so miracilous we expect something else more miraclous. For example, when I think about myself as a human being creation, I see a miracle. The feeling, the thinking, the sight, breathing, pain and other tangible and intangible feelings. I come up with that the one who made this is able to do things more complicated.

However, sometimes, and for the lack of our knowledge back up with satan whispering, we try to doubt about some unknown jestures in Islam like the way we pray et al.

But after all, faith is un-explainable thing and I see it as a bless from Allah granted to us and the choice is to us in how to use it.

[ns8t]

We are simple human creation who call a thing irrational only if we dont understand the pattern, cause and effect. Did musa (Moses) upon whom we pray peace, understand the rationality of his teacher who destroyed boats, and slaughtered a child? Hajj is divinely decreed, and has pattern, rationality even if Ghazali and ourselves dont understand. One day we may know, if God allows.

[amo_l_oman]

The hajj is the most irrational thing in Islam. There we perform gestures and rites that are absolutely irrational. For this reason the hajj is the place where we can, better than in any other place, demonstrate our faith because reason does not understand anything at all of it and only faith makes us do those actions. Blind obedience to God is the best evidence of our Islam.

Do you have a more complete abstract than this ?
Read other parts of this work from Imam al Ghazali and find this statement strange coming from him .
Hajj is made of rituals that represent important moments of Islamic life and history and it's the reaffirmation of our connection with God as part of the community .
Nothing irrational in it .