Hell!! who's in it?

[Lucaria]

So a friend of mine came to me once and asked: “as a Muslim, do you believe that I’ll go to Hell?”


Friend’s background:
He believes in the existence of one god, but doesn’t have a particular religion.
He doesn’t drink, do drugs and basically anything bad… and his reason is, “he knows its bad for him”.


I was wondering what would be the right answer to his question!

[CatChy]

As Muslims we believe that the disbelievers/ kuffar will go to Hell, but we cannot and we are not supposed or allowed to say that this person or that are going to Hell. ولاتقف ماليس لك به علم They might convert to Islam later & the whole issue is related to the unseen which nobody knows about, but Allah. The right answer is "Allahu A3lam" Allah knows best.

[Arabian Prince]

“as a Muslim, do you believe that I’ll go to Hell?”
I would say that it all lies in the question itself. Since he mentioned Hell, that means he believes in it or atleast its equivalent.
If I were to give it some thought.. I would answer him from Islam's point of view and not my own. Not only would that avoid any probably tension, but it would also avoid what CatChy mentioned, speaking the unseen.
In my point of view, the best way to deal with it would be to explain to him how and why Islam see's it to be in such way, lead him to believe it is a fair way of concluding with such assumptions. Then explain how 'you' are obligated to believe in that. :)
But in the end let him know that we also believe that 'Allahu '3afooron Ra7eem' and it is he who will decide in the end who goes to Heaven or Hell :)

[HITMAN]

wrong doers will go to hell no matter what religion they r...

[Violet]

even if he was a good person...the reason of us being here is to obey god rules.. "wama 5alakna al jin wal insa ela lia3bdoon" no matter how perfect he/she is

[Lucaria]

In my point of view, the best way to deal with it would be to explain to him how and why Islam see's it to be in such way,

wat do you mean exactly?

wat i think he ment by his question, was that... in islam, do we believe that all non-muslims go to hell??

and doesn't 3eebada mean believing that there is one allah?

[IceTea]

Let us go back to the Quran:


لَيْسَ بِأَمَانِيِّكُمْ وَلَا أَمَانِيِّ أَهْلِ الْكِتَابِ مَنْ يَعْمَلْ سُوءًا يُجْزَ بِهِ وَلَا يَجِدْ لَهُ مِنْ دُونِ اللَّهِ وَلِيًّا وَلَا نَصِيرًا
وَمَنْ يَعْمَلْ مِنَ الصَّالِحَاتِ مِنْ ذَكَرٍ أَوْ أُنْثَى وَهُوَ مُؤْمِنٌ فَأُولَئِكَ يَدْخُلُونَ الْجَنَّةَ وَلَا يُظْلَمُونَ نَقِيرًا
وَمَنْ أَحْسَنُ دِينًا مِمَّنْ أَسْلَمَ وَجْهَهُ لِلَّهِ وَهُوَ مُحْسِنٌ وَاتَّبَعَ مِلَّةَ إِبْرَاهِيمَ حَنِيفًا وَاتَّخَذَ اللَّهُ إِبْرَاهِيمَ خَلِيلًا

إِنَّ الدِّينَ عِنْدَ اللَّهِ الْإِسْلَامُ وَمَا اخْتَلَفَ الَّذِينَ أُوتُوا الْكِتَابَ إِلَّا مِنْ بَعْدِ مَا جَاءَهُمُ الْعِلْمُ بَغْيًا بَيْنَهُمْ وَمَنْ يَكْفُرْ بِآيَاتِ اللَّهِ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ سَرِيعُ الْحِسَابِ

وَمَنْ يَبْتَغِ غَيْرَ الْإِسْلَامِ دِينًا فَلَنْ يُقْبَلَ مِنْهُ وَهُوَ فِي الْآخِرَةِ مِنَ الْخَاسِرِينَ

[CookieMonster]

Tell him you don't... and that u would never know who will go to hell and who wouldn't, u cant just judge people about going to hell or heaven its js not fair...u don't know what gonna happen to him in the future, he might become a better muslim than all of us!!....

If he believes in God... then that's a good thing...

I was really dissapointed when everyone was like: Heyyy pope died he's going to hell,and gosh I dunno how he's sufferin right now in his grave..hmm...

I was js SHOCKED to hear that!!... the man has done lots of good things in his life and he believed in God... I know he believed in some things that we believe are wrong, but no one knows how God sees him....and I know...that God's mercy on his creatures is more than the mercy of a mother on her son...

.................some people think theyr just better than others because theyr js Muslim...well hey I've never seen any muslim do what Mother Terressa did!

[Arabian Prince]

wat do you mean exactly?
What I meant was, try to show him that it is Islam that see's it to be that way in the first place (see's that all non-muslims end up in hell). Basically here you are just getting yourself out of a trap. Then you could manoeuver your way through to your own opinion on the topic.
That way, you show him that it is not really what you think should happen, which in turn avoids tension as I had previously mentioned, and it allows your opinion to be backed up by your religion which is a much greater thing to argue :) Hence you would be on the safe side.

Feel free to ask me to emphasize on any part of what I have said. :)

[sophis^catrina]

He believes in the existence of one god, but doesn’t have a particular religion.



There lies your answer. He believes in Allah. He is not a kaffir. Whether or not he goes to hell or heaven is for Allah to judge, your friend's heart and deeds. For He forgives everything, but kufr/shirk. Islam has two meanings; the first is the whole religion with all it's arkan, and the second is to submit to Allah and being a monotheist. So it really depends on what Allah decides to judge him on.

But when thing you must remember, is that the amount of knowledge that a person has concerning religion is very much taken into account. A person is who has been exposed to Islam and has great knowledge in it will be judged more harshly (as in why didn't he follow Islam as a whole) than someone who has not heard of Islam in the first place.

Just tell him best for him to research more on religions, till he finds one that gives him peace and tranquility. If he believes in one God in the first place, then he should look at Islam much more closely, since he already believes in the first basic tenent of Islam (a simplistic form of monotheism). Tell him to research on his own, and not to be frightened away by those self-proclaimed muftis who think they know what Islam is all abt, who focus on deeds more than faith, and to have an open heart.

P.S. If he has any questions, I can try helping him out, I've done my share when it comes to questioning and researching other religions. ;)

[Lucaria]

IceTea, could you please translate it to english, i have difficulty reading the font, and ofcoz for the non arab members :)


Cookie, thanks for postng newie :p...you've got good points :)

AP, :D i dont think they'd attack me or anything, i dont wanna try to be on the safe side, i wanna try to convince them about islam, and tell them that its the right religion...i dont think they're getting a good picture of it from wat we see in the world



Tell him to research on his own, and not to be frightened away by those self-proclaimed muftis who think they know what Islam is all abt, who focus on deeds more than faith, and to have an open heart.

thats exactly wat he was afraid of :shy:
thanks :)

[sophis^catrina]

^^^ Jesus (AS) once passed by a bunch of people and asked them why did they believe and worship Allah, they said they worshipped Allah because they want to enter heaven. Jesus said, I don't belong to your group. He then met another group wrhshipping Allah and asked them why did they worship. They answered they worshipped coz they were scared of entering hell. He said, I don't belong to your group either. He then met another group and asked them the same question. They replied saying that they worshipped Allah, because of love for Him. And finally Jesus said, I belong to your group.

That's how it should be. You should be a follower of religion, because you believe and love Allah. :) So as for your friend, he better ignore all those frightening comments of "you'll go to hell if you don't do this!", and focus on what religion promotes; love, peace at heart and spirituality. That's when the true beauty of religion shines.

[EarThQuaKe]

So a friend of mine came to me once and asked: “as a Muslim, do you believe that I’ll go to Hell?”
I was wondering what would be the right answer to his question!

This could be very complicated or it could be very easy depending on the angle you are looking at it. :)

This is 3aqeeda so you have to mention sects. The easiest saying is: He is definitely going to hell just like you, me and the prophets. He is also definitely going to heaven just like you, me and Satan (Iblees).

If you want the complicated definition then read the quran and you will know the answer. I am saying this because each person has a different opinion.

My sect opinion (Ibadhi) does not and will not say that a particular person will or will not go to heaven or hell. They give fatwa according to doings and not persons. Their fatwas are also "this is haram from the kaba'er ....... or this is one of the pillars of islam ........" :)

[Enigma]

Lucy, do one thing..

Tell your friend, that while we believe that we are following the right path and there is no other, Allah SWT did not grant us the knowledge of knowing exactly who goes where. And so when we are asked, we say Allahu A3lam and nothing else. :)

[Arabian Prince]

Sophy thanks alot for sharing that story with us! :)
I really liked Sophy's reply and Niggy's too. Subtle, simple and portraying the upside of things :)

Earthy... your reply seems to be too complicated for even a muslim or any other believer in one of the celestial books. The Prophet (PBUH) ordered us to make religion loved and not hated, easy and not complicated. That ofcourse would apply to newcomers. I don't see how your reply does that?
Why show him how one religion has different groups/sects and each sect has its own beliefs opinions and explanations?! Isn't that making life harder on him?

I just believe that in Lucaria's case a better reply to that question would be similar to what Sophy and Niggy had to say. :)

[sophis^catrina]

^^^ Exactly the main msg of Islam is very simple. The belief in one Creator and that Muhammed (PBUH) is his messenger.

He should focus on the first two. The rest will automatically follow ;). After all the Prophet (PBUH) focused on the 3aqeeda (belief) system first, and then when people believed that's when he started to focus on the Islam laws (fiqh). :)

[Lucaria]

thanks guys :) ...sophy i loved that story as well

[EarThQuaKe]

The Prophet (PBUH) ordered us to make religion loved and not hated, easy and not complicated. That ofcourse would apply to newcomers. I don't see how your reply does that?

OK AP... I'll make it as simple as possible.

There is a unique sect, which is now followed my almost all Sunni and Shi3i sects. Its called Al-Muraji'ah. المرجئة

To give you a hint of what it says, I'll quote one of the scholars who follow it. His name is Something Al-Kubaisi. He said when he talked about the huge mosque in Oman. إن الله ليستحي أن يدخل هذا الرجل النار. Allah will be shamed to send this man (refering to Qaboos) into hell.

Put the quran and the sunnah in one of your drawers, which you'll never open again and memorise this hadeeth. عن أبي الأسود الدِّيلي أن أبا ذر حدثه أنه قال: أتيت النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم وهو نائم، عليه ثوب أبيض، ثم أتيته فإذا هو نائم، ثم أتيته وقد استيقظ، فجلست إليه، فقال: ((ما من عبد قال لا إله إلا الله، ثم مات على ذلك إلا دخل الجنة )) قلت: وإن زنى وإن سرق؟ قال: ((وإن زنى وإن سرق ))، قلت: وإن زنى وإن سرق؟ قال: ((وإن زنى وإن سرق )) وثلاثاً، ثم قال في الرابعة: ((على رغم أنف أبي ذر، )) قال: فخرج أبو ذر وهو يقول: وإن رغم أنف أبي ذر. (م1/66).

Translation: Blah, blah blah... Prophet said: Any servant who say (La Illah Illa Allah then he dies will go to heaven. Abu thar said: Even if he committed zina and stole. Prophet said: Even if he committed zina and stole. Abu thar said: Even if he committed zina and stole. Prophet said: Even if he committed zina and stole. Three times and in the forth the prophet said: Even if Abi thar doesn't like it.

If you are one then tell your friend that he is going to heaven no matter what he did. Even if he raped his mother and killed his father.

Personally, I flush this quote, which people say is a hadeeth down the toilet. I also refuse to step on my beliefs and lie. This is why I told you in my first reply that you should read quran and true (What you believe is true) sunnah and figure it out.

As Immam Albahlani said: We refuse to copy our religion from people who have no 3i9mah.

When you can come up with an answer that all muslims agree upon then please let me know. Thank you. :)

[Lucaria]

If you are one then tell your friend that he is going to heaven no matter what he did. Even if he raped his mother and killed his father.

Personally, I flush this quote, which people say is a hadeeth down the toilet.


:think: so u're saying that the hadeeth's not true, but i should still tell my firend he's going to heaven??

[EarThQuaKe]

:think: so u're saying that the hadeeth's not true, but i should still tell my firend he's going to heaven??

Well, can you discuss the sanad and mattan of the hadith. I told you nowadays 95% + of muslims believe in this hadith.

Personally, I won't even discuss the sanad of the hadith because this hadith contradicts with the QURAN, SUNNAH and the salaf.

Explanation:

Allah said: والذين لا يدعون مع الله إلها آخر ولا يقتلون النفس التي حرم الله إلا بالحق ولا يزنون ومن يفعل ذلك يلق أثاما ﴿68﴾ يضاعف له العذاب يوم القيامة ويخلد فيه مهانا ﴿69

Those who invoke not, with Allah, any other god, nor slay such life as Allah has made sacred except for just cause, nor commit fornication; - and any that does this (not only) meets punishment. * (But) the Penalty on the Day of Judgment will be doubled to him, and he will dwell therein in ignominy,-
{25:68-69}

The prophet said: حدثنا ‏ ‏عبيد الله بن معاذ ‏ ‏حدثنا ‏ ‏أبي ‏ ‏حدثنا ‏ ‏عاصم وهو ابن محمد بن زيد بن عبد الله بن عمر ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏أبيه ‏ ‏قال قال ‏ ‏عبد الله ‏
‏قال رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏بني الإسلام على خمس شهادة أن لا إله إلا الله وأن ‏ ‏محمدا عبده ورسوله ‏ ‏وإقام الصلاة وإيتاء الزكاة وحج ‏ ‏البيت ‏ ‏وصوم رمضان ‏

The pillars of islam are 5: The shahadah, Salah, Zakah, Hajj and Fasting of Ramadhan.

From the salaf: Why did Abu Bakir ratheya allah 3anh and the sahabah fight the people who refuse to pay the zakah? Why were they called 'Murtadein'? They only refused to pay zakah, but they still believe in allah.

Its either that once a muslim refuses a pillar in islam is no longer a true muslim or all of the sahabah committed a huge crime and they are going to hell because of it. I guess we all know that killing another muslim is a huge sin.

One more thing, the hadith only mentions a part of the shahadah, 'La Illah Illa Allah' and it does not include 'Wa Anna Mohammed Rassoul Allah'. What does this exactly mean?

[Arabian Prince]

The Prophet (PBUH) ordered us to make religion loved and not hated, easy and not complicated. That ofcourse would apply to newcomers. I don't see how your reply does that?

Yes I did copy and paste... only this time I think it should say "I dont see how your 'replies' do that? :)

No I'm not trying to irritate you here, but you have to understand this is not the clash of two religions or sects. In my point of view (with all due respect), 70% of your replies had no relevancy to the raised topic whatsoever. What good is this to poor lucaria and her wondering friend??

I am more than happy to further argue your point (which by the way is kind of hard since I do agree with almost all of what you've said), however I do think it should be done elsewhere, in another thread.

Have a nice day! :)

[EarThQuaKe]

The Prophet (PBUH) ordered us to make religion loved and not hated, easy and not complicated. That ofcourse would apply to newcomers. I don't see how your reply does that?

Yes I did copy and paste... only this time I think it should say "I dont see how your 'replies' do that? :)

No I'm not trying to irritate you here, but you have to understand this is not the clash of two religions or sects. In my point of view (with all due respect), 70% of your replies had no relevancy to the raised topic whatsoever. What good is this to poor lucaria and her wondering friend??

I am more than happy to further argue your point (which by the way is kind of hard since I do agree with almost all of what you've said), however I do think it should be done elsewhere, in another thread.

Have a nice day! :)

First of all, the saying of loved not hated has a wide meaning. Is it because I want religion to be love not hated, I can tell my friends to drink alcohol. There are always boudries. What exactly is the use for that guy to enter islam, if he is going to heaven without being a muslim?

OK.... Forget about all of the past replies. If your friend asks you, will I go to heaven then you can either tell him. Yes, you will go to heaven, even if you raped your mother and killed your father. I wonder how could that make him love islam not hate it. :p Now if that is not true and to me its not true then you bare with the sin you have committed. :)

Else, tell him that heaven is not a given and its not the default destination for you or me. Islam is a religion of belief and doing. There is no use in you being a muslim, if you do not care about what is forbidden and what is not. I am doing many good deeds, but am also committing many sins. I pray daily to allah so I can go to heaven and not to hell. I do tawbah every few hours and I am still afraid of going to hell.

You see, my mother is the most person I love and I will do anything to see her happy, but if you ask me if she is going to heaven or hell. Then I'll tell you I don't know. I am not god so I can send people where I want to. I am a servant for him. I am here to obey him, whether I like it or not. My role is do, don't do and advice when I have the knowledge to. I only pray that I will go to heaven with my mother and the rest of the muslim world.

This is a complicated stuff and love or hate is not a major issue especially if your life in the hereafter can be decided with one word.

You read the quran and you will know what you should reply to your friend because in the end its between you, him and Allah.

[MsKnuckles]

According to what I know, any person who believes in god and does good deeds has a chance to go to heaven... so why all the complications??

[Shinoda LP]

According to what I know, any person who believes in god and does good deeds has a chance to go to heaven... so why all the complications??

I don't believe in any one particular God. I do believe in a force though (seriously, its not the star wars impact). No, its not Allah or any other Hindu or Christian Gods. And yes, I do believe that only good will come on someone who does good deeds and wishes good on other people. I'm not sure if there's anything like a heaven either.

Why all the complications then? Because, if you ask me, the whole idea of heaven, hell and different religions out there that meet your needs and quenches your spiritual thirst are human made to keep humanity in check and order. Well, thats only my personal thought ... humans are known to complicate issues by creating complex situations and then wondering how the hell they got into such a situation in the first place and since they're already there, how to figure out a way to cause as less of a mess as possible. ;)

[EarThQuaKe]

According to what I know, any person who believes in god and does good deeds has a chance to go to heaven... so why all the complications??

Do you mean believe in god and the prophet or god only. :)

The complication is on the word chance. We all have a chance, but does this chance entitles us to be sure that we are going to heaven. :)