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X-press
03-03-05, 03:13 AM
The below text was taken from the site 'service.spiegel.de'
THE DEATH OF A MUSLIM WOMAN

By Jody K. Biehl in Berlin

In the past four months, six Muslim women living in Berlin have been brutally murdered by family members. Their crime? Trying to break free and live Western lifestyles. Within their communities, the killers are revered as heroes for preserving their family dignity. How can such a horrific and shockingly archaic practice be flourishing in the heart of Europe? The deaths have sparked momentary outrage, but will they change the grim reality for Muslim women?

Pic edited
Hatin Surucu just wanted to live her own life. Instead, she became Berlin's latest victim of honor killings. Her Turkish Muslim brothers allegedly gunned her down for adopting Western ways.

The shots came from nowhere and within minutes the young Turkish mother standing at the Berlin bus stop was dead. A telephone call from a relative had brought her to this cold, unforgiving place. She thought she would only be gone for a few minutes and wore a light jacket in the freezing February wind.

She had left her five-year-old son asleep in his bed. He awoke looking for his mother, who, like many Turkish women in Germany, harbored a secret life of fear, courage and, ultimately, grief. Now her little boy has his own tragedy to bear: His mother, Hatin Surucu, was not the victim of random violence, but likely died at the hands of her own family in what is known as an "honor killing."

Hatin's crime, it appears, was the desire to lead a normal life in her family's adopted land. The vivacious 23-year-old beauty, who was raised in Berlin, divorced the Turkish cousin she was forced to marry at age 16. She also discarded her Islamic head scarf, enrolled in a technical school where she was training to become an electrician and began dating German men.

For her family, such behavior represented the ultimate shame -- the embrace of "corrupt" Western ways. .....
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For more, click on this article => THE DEATH OF A MUSLIM WOMAN (http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/0,1518,344374,00.html)
~ To your opinion, do you agree or not that Hatin Surucu committed 'a crime' by adopting a Western way of living?

~ Did she 'deserve' to be killed for the 'crimes' her family believed she committed?

~ When it comes to 'Honor Killing', would you agree or disagree to go for this option, if a close member of your family (expl sister) choose to live the way Hatin Surucu did?

Thanks in advance for your answers.

EarThQuaKe
03-03-05, 03:43 AM
1. Dear Xp, I don't think there is a need for the picture. This is the religion (islamic) sabla and posting such a picture is against the islamic teachings.

2. This was inside the text you quoted:

How can such a horrific and shockingly archaic practice be flourishing in the heart of Europe? The deaths have sparked momentary outrage, but will they change the grim reality for Muslim women? These sentences or questions are giving a specific point of view that will effect the reader's emotions.

3.
~ To your opinion, do you agree or not that Hatin Surucu committed 'a crime' by adopting a Western way of living? Dating many men and revealing what is not supposed to be revealed are "crimes" against islam.

4.
~ Did she 'deserve' to be killed for the 'crimes' her family believed she committed? According to what I know about islam. The family committed a crime when they killed her. First of all, law in islam is determined in courts and with trusted witnesses. Refering to islam, the family disobeyed one of the most important rulings. If she 'desereved' to be killed or not can only be determined in an 'islamic' court.

5.
~ When it comes to 'Honor Killing', would you agree or disagree to go for this option, if a close member of your family (expl sister) choose to live the way Hatin Surucu did? I disagree because according to islam after puberty each person is resposible for his acts and others can only give advice or provide enough evidence before going to court to make a claim. I will not answer the second part of the question.

PhaHaDde
03-03-05, 04:07 AM
Salam,

XP:Nice thread , but I don't think it's a good idea to put the picture for the same reasons brother EQ mentioned.

EQ:Great reply.

I just wanna add something. I am completely against the murder of that girl. If she did wrong she should be judged with witnesses & strong proof.

There is no such thing in islam as kill for dignity. Those who committed the murder they are considered killed on intention of killing & they should be judged.

A wrong act will never be corrected by giving a wrong reaction.

Salam..

CrazyReD
03-03-05, 06:43 AM
yeah nice topic exxy

and Wq summrized it best

Arabian Princess
03-03-05, 10:40 PM
wouldnt add more than what EQ said ..

she did something wrong by dating non-muslims, but it doesnt justify killing her.

fatamooo
03-03-05, 11:30 PM
I think honor killing is a pre-islamic thing isnt it? does it say anywhere in the Qoran or with the prophet that it's allowed?

CrazyReD
04-03-05, 12:50 AM
yeah it's more like some stupid tradition

Lym
04-03-05, 03:04 AM
~ To your opinion, do you agree or not that Hatin Surucu committed 'a crime' by adopting a Western way of living?
Well , I don't think she is a criminal ( too strong of a word ) but I think she did do something wrong by going against the teachings of Islam :mmhmm:

~ Did she 'deserve' to be killed for the 'crimes' her family believed she committed?
Nope , who are they to take away her life ? Who are they to judge her for her actions?
I am so shocked ! They disgust me .. :angry:

~ When it comes to 'Honor Killing', would you agree or disagree to go for this option, if a close member of your family (expl sister) choose to live the way Hatin Surucu did?
Never. The most appropriate option in this case would be to disown her , not murder her. this way the family can still maintain their so called " dignity"
but I would never disown my sister , no matter what ! :bomb:

mimosa
04-03-05, 11:01 AM
Religion and religious practice are a choice. Put it this way: If she had gone back to her previous way of living just out of fear of her family, wouldn't it be meaningless anyway? Only she can determine her faith. Man canot see into the heart of man, let alone change it by force.

As Sayyidna 3isa said: "Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone"

Pineapple Thief
04-03-05, 11:04 AM
''Their crime? Trying to break free and live Western lifestyles. Within their communities, the killers are revered as heroes for preserving their family dignity. How can such a horrific and shockingly archaic practice be flourishing in the heart of Europe? The deaths have sparked momentary outrage, but will they change the grim reality for Muslim women?''

I think the way the article is written is quite disgusting, almost as disgusting as the crime itself.

mimosa
04-03-05, 12:17 PM
Fair point Mr Nipple. The tabloids in Germany are nearly as bad as the ones in the UK :rolleyes: I agree that the image painted of Muslim women being "trapped" by their culture is unfair. Then again, in this case it was clearly true, as the outcome shows.

Pineapple Thief
04-03-05, 03:34 PM
However, its true in her case. Whether its true in all cases or not is not clear from the article...but it is implied!

But this is off topic, my vendetta against banks, tabloids and African Math Teachers should not spill over into Sabla.

Nas5
04-03-05, 05:14 PM
Great point xp
1.She did something wrong but not desreves death
What did the german authority do??