This was what an arabic leader did!!

[IceTea]

"Borkaiba" is removing women Islamic hijab!!

No comments!! (http://www.al-sharqalawsat.com/vid/borkaiba.wmv).

[Shinoda LP]

Who's that dude again? And what the hell was he doing? :|

[amo_l_oman]

yalla am @work can you post an english html link pls

[Muscati]

Borqaiba was the president of Tunisia for 30 years from 1957 to 87. He's compared to Turkey's Ataturk because he was very pro-west and wanted to modernise the country by banning things which he didn't consider modern. He banned the hijab and polygamy.

[amo_l_oman]

Thanks Muscati.
Seems to be issue of pride to be seen as country of reforms and freedom compared to others, in order to enter the doors of western business by having more credibility with such acts:

Tunisia has completed a large number of reforms in the past 14 years.
Ben Yahia: As they say in Washington—Tunisia has "graduated," from an economic point of view. Our rate of growth over the last decade was averaging 5.4 percent per year. Our social development indicators are very striking—about 80% of Tunisian society, according to World Bank criteria, are now considered Middle Class.
One must also consider the emancipation of our women, and the abolition of polygamy. Tunisia was the first Arab/Muslim country, two years after our independence, to have abolished polygamy.
Our schools used to be separate…boys and girls. Now we have mixed schools.
We couldn’t have succeeded in family planning policy, reducing the overall demographic growth rate from 3.2 percent in 1965, to 1.1 percent last year, if we had not started with the emancipation of our women. So many things of these things are interconnected.
At this time, when people are talking about reforms in Arab countries and the Middle East, Tunisia’s story should be heard—because it has done its reform and its homework earlier than anybody else.
It’s not perfect. A lot of reforms are still pending: development, social economic development, political development, cultural revolutions, sports…what have you. There is no instant coffee-type of recipe to bring about reform all at once. It takes hard work, imagination, and leadership. That is what helped Tunisia to address these issues far ahead of time.

How is it that Tunisia has escaped the problems of fundamentalism when so many other countries across North Africa and the Middle East region have experienced such difficulty?
Ben Yahia: Our struggle against fundamentalism was not fought with bullets, but with brains. We developed our rural areas, doubled our investment there. It was done with something called our National Solidarity Fund…through donations. We have about $65 million per year that will not go through the treasury—very rapid disbursement directly to each region—that enabled us to struggle against poverty very quickly. These are recipes of Tunisia’s experimentation—the untold story of Tunisia’s success.
It’s high time now for us, and our friends, to make it known and, maybe, have it as a source of inspiration. Reforms can be done in an Arab, Muslim, African, Mediterranean country…but not with a magic stick.


http://www.internationalreports.net/africa/tunisia/2004/interview.html

[MoonChild]

The way to do it is NOT to ban hijab, but allow women the freedom to choose whether to wear it or not- make it a private religious decision, not mandated by law and punishable by government.

Like Oman :)

[Orion]

Originally posted by MoonChild
The way to do it is NOT to ban hijab, but allow women the freedom to choose whether to wear it or not- make it a private religious decision, not mandated by law and punishable by government.

Like Oman :)

Yeah!!! The voice of western moderation, decency and true liberalism has spoken!

Now Moony, could you convince +50% of your countries citizens to approach the problem here with that mindset.

:scratch:

[Desert_Sloath]

and what is Tunisia's HUMAN Right record say ?

[amo_l_oman]

says bad

http://www.hrw.org/wr2k3/mideast8.html#defending

[Enigma]

Originally posted by MoonChild
The way to do it is NOT to ban hijab, but allow women the freedom to choose whether to wear it or not- make it a private religious decision, not mandated by law and punishable by government.

Like Oman :)

I totally agree. There is a verse in the Quran which states that no one should be forced religiously, can't recall it exactly though.

But one thing Moons; a girl can walk around in Oman hijabless and the law won't enforce it.... but society will ;)

[Arabian Princess]

Originally posted by Enigma
I totally agree. There is a verse in the Quran which states that no one should be forced religiously, can't recall it exactly though.

But one thing Moons; a girl can walk around in Oman hijabless and the law won't enforce it.... but society will ;)

but no one should go and encourage people to throw out thier Hijab!!

Turkey was until the mid of the last century the biggest muslim empire, I couldnt see a sign of Islam when I went there last year!

I've never been to Tuniesia .. but I think its a shame that the country leader is publicly removing a lady's hijab! He could leave it to thier choice but not encourge it to be done!!

[IceTea]

I wonder why arabic/Islamic country still follow the French laws up to today. Even men not allowed to marry more than one wife, it's like saying to muslims it's haram while in the Quran allowed. What kind of country is this? :rolleyes:

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by IceTea
"Borkaiba" is removing women Islamic hijab!!

No comments!! (http://www.al-sharqalawsat.com/vid/borkaiba.wmv). If I could I would have removed his underpants by force. So he could feel, what he has done to those poor women infront of puplic without their choice.

[IceTea]

Originally posted by Nocia9600
If I could I would have removed his underpants by force. So he could feel, what he has done to those poor women infront of puplic without their choice.

I don't see any difference between him and the Satan.

[FluidNutria]

he is and arse!

[Amir]

Sad to see people doing all this. My friend a Turkish, was telling me about her mum, she's been asked many times to remove her jijab while being at Turkish parties by her family friends.

This is really sad!!!

:(

[Cerulean]

I've got nothing against them banning Polygamy. (I bet I'm no. 1 on Icys enemy list!) but banning the hijab is wrong. People should have the freedom of choice when it comes wearing it.. I dont see how the hijab is stopping the country from becoming "modern".

[IceTea]

Originally posted by Cerulean
I've got nothing against them banning Polygamy. (I bet I'm no. 1 on Icys enemy list!) but banning the hijab is wrong. People should have the freedom of choice when it comes wearing it.. I dont see how the hijab is stopping the country from becoming "modern".

They don't have the right to ban anything which is halal in Islam, it should be a personal choice and not by force.

And you are not my enemy, don't worry ;).

[Cerulean]

Originally posted by IceTea

And you are not my enemy, don't worry ;).

I'm not worried. :D Frankly speaking, I don't care two pins.

[Scarlet]

What the hell does that guy think he is doing?!
I mean he's removing the Hijab from women's head!! Uncovering them! while those ignorant women laugh and KISS him!:no:

I really have no comment!!:fire:

[sanwin25]

I really have no comment!!

That much is obvious.

[TeaBagger]

Originally posted by Scarlet
What the hell does that guy think he is doing?!
I mean he's removing the Hijab from women's head!! Uncovering them! while those ignorant women laugh and KISS him!:no:

I really have no comment!!:fire:

And why are they ignorant?

Is the Hijab mentioned in the Koran?

[Scarlet]

Originally posted by TeaBagger
And why are they ignorant?

0Is the Hijab mentioned in the Koran?

Are you a muslim? If so, read the Qura'an plz!:rolleyes:
If your not, then yes, it is mentioned in the Qura'an.

[TeaBagger]

Originally posted by Scarlet
Are you a muslim? If so, read the Qura'an plz!:rolleyes:
If your not, then yes, it is mentioned in the Qura'an.

Where in the book is it mentioned?

[Scarlet]

Originally posted by TeaBagger
Where in the book is it mentioned?

Read it and find out urself:rolleyes:

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by TeaBagger
And why are they ignorant?

Is the Hijab mentioned in the Koran?
Here it is

033.059
YUSUFALI: O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women, that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad): that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

PICKTHAL: O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them (when they go abroad). That will be better, so that they may be recognised and not annoyed. Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful.

SHAKIR: O Prophet! say to your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers that they let down upon them their over-garments; this will be more proper, that they may be known, and thus they will not be given trouble; and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

[sanwin25]

Don't see the word Hijab anywhere there.

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by sanwin25
Don't see the word Hijab anywhere there. Jalabihina = their over-garments.

And here another Verse of veiling

24:31 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husbands' sons, their brothers or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex; and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss.

[sanwin25]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Nocia9600
Jalabihina = their over-garments.

And here another Verse of veiling

24:31 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husbands' sons, their brothers or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex; and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss.

http://www.er.uqam.ca/pasteur/e203764/images3/hijab.jpg - Hijab

http://www.jetcityjimbo.com/awful_wonderful_ii/images/photos/t_costume2.jpg - Cleanest picture of a bosom I could find.

Do you see the difference ?

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by sanwin25
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Nocia9600


Do you see the difference ? Yah I can c the beuty of the Hijab compared to the other homosexually photo.

[sanwin25]

Don't admire the picture. Tell me how the picture of the Hijab is according to the description in the Quran.

[TeaBagger]

Originally posted by Scarlet
Read it and find out urself:rolleyes:

No thanks. I'm still trying to finish reading my book, the Bible.

[MoonChild]

The verses posted say only to dress modestly and bare your breasts in public ... how did you get to covering your HAIR and FACE from this???!

[jack]

Originally posted by MoonChild
The verses posted say only to dress modestly and bare your breasts in public ... how did you get to covering your HAIR and FACE from this???! Opppps .... not :p

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by sanwin25
Don't admire the picture. Tell me how the picture of the Hijab is according to the description in the Quran. The arabic word "Hijab" is transalated in English as VEIL.

And there fore they told to "draw their veils over their bosoms "

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by MoonChild
The verses posted say only to dress modestly and bare your breasts in public ... how did you get to covering your HAIR and FACE from this???! Thanks MoonChild do not blame us when we come strong. U ask the verses I provide. Now u can we word "bare" this is the answer

I know in west culture u approved of women dacing naked in dacing floor and men makes fool of them and That is the VALUE u want export to other countries

I say please keep it.

[TeaBagger]

I know in west culture u approved of women dacing naked in dacing floor and men makes fool of them and That is the VALUE u want export to other countries

We don't make an effort to export these "values" to other countries. Some countries make an effort to import them. Look at China and the Soviet Union. Their younger generations try to emulate our music , dress attire, etc.

[MoonChild]

Ooops sorry, I meant not bare your breasts in public ... ie "cover".

OK, your religion says to use a "veil" to cover your bosom in public (I find that a shirt works just as well :rolleyes: ). The club phenom you speak of is quite recent even in the west and many of us think that those who dress in revealing styles are tramps. So? It's not being forced on you.

I'm still wondering where the hair and face come in, that's all! If it's a cultural hand-me-down from pagan Arabia, just spit it out! :bang:

[MoonChild]

Originally posted by Nocia9600
I know in west culture u approved of women dacing naked in dacing floor

People are required to be clothed (however scantily) in clubs. "Gentlemen's Clubs" are private, restricted to "over 21", and the naked women there are being paid to be naked, by the eager male consumers :rolleyes:

Trust me, most of their wives do NOT approve.

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by MoonChild
Ooops sorry, I meant not bare your breasts in public ... ie "cover".

Fair enough



Originally posted by MoonChild I'm still wondering where the hair and face come in, that's all! [/B]

In Arab culture Hijab (veil) is used to cover hair and here the quran telling them to "draw their veils over their bosoms "

We are talking about veil and not skirt.

Dictionary meaning of VEIL

1 A piece of linen or other fabric forming part of a nun's head-dress, and worn so as to drape the head and shoulders. ME.

2 A piece of thin, light, or transparent fabric (now usu. attached to a hat or other head-dress) worn, esp. by women, over the head or face for concealment or to protect the face from the sun, dust, etc. ME.



Dictionary meaning of DRAW

1. ba v.t. Cause (something) to move towards, or past a part of, oneself by the application of force; pull. OE.

2. b v.t. Pull (a veil etc.) over something so as to conceal it; pull (a curtain, blinds) open or shut. LME.

---------------------------------------------------------
Excerpted from Oxford Talking Dictionary
Copyright © 1998 The Learning Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved.

[MoonChild]

LOL, so according to your dictionary, the pre-Islamic (pagan) Arabic practice of wearing a filmy veil over one's hair and possibly face, to protect one from the dust and sun, was then called upon by Allah to be pulled over the breasts as well in order to preserve modesty.

It still doesn't add up.

[Nocia9600]

Originally posted by MoonChild
LOL, so according to your dictionary, the pre-Islamic (pagan) Arabic practice of wearing a filmy veil over one's hair and possibly face, to protect one from the dust and sun, was then called upon by Allah to be pulled over the breasts as well in order to preserve modesty.

It still doesn't add up. You u went for no 2 meaning what about

1.A piece of linen or other fabric forming part of a nun's head-dress, and worn so as to drape the head and shoulders. ME

AS u know one word can have many meaning in a dictionary.
If u can read Arabic then read what word "hijab (veil)" means.

I have no problem with the meaning of muslim (Hijab)veil I use English dictionary for u because u were talking about Skirt.

[MoonChild]

"The verses posted say only to dress modestly and [not] bare your breasts in public ... how did you get to covering your HAIR and FACE from this???!"

Excuse me, where did I mention a skirt?

Are you on something?

[Nocia9600]

Please Go back read versel 24:31 carefully ther word "VEILS" (Hijab) is mentioned.

Then read my privious posts after the versel.

You said something about skirt or shirt in your earlier posts.

Why start again:wave: :wave: