View Full Version : Who Follows What?


Enigma
10-06-04, 04:28 PM
As I understand it; Deuteronomy, Genesis, Exodus, Numbers and Leviticus make up the Torah and part of the Old Testament of the Bible.

This brings up a few questions:

Do ALL sects of Christianity follow the New Testament?

I know the Old Testament is a mixture of the Torah with new chapters. Who follows the Torah and who follows the Old Testament?

MoonChild
10-06-04, 06:28 PM
Originally posted by Enigma

Do ALL sects of Christianity follow the New Testament?

Yes, or they wouldn't be Christian. There are various interpretations of how strictly to adhere to certain verses as "rules for living", but the basic code of conduct is pretty clear...

[b]I know the Old Testament is a mixture of the Torah with new chapters. Who follows the Torah and who follows the Old Testament?

Torah = Jews for sure.
All the various Christian churches I have been to have advocated reading the OT as the message of God and the history of His People and the world, but treat the (often very harsh) rules of Deuteronomy and Leviticus as the laws that Jesus was sent to release people from in favor of what is essentially the Golden Rule ("do unto others as you would have them do unto you").

One exception that I know of is the Jehovah's Witnesses, who do feel that the OT is still relevent today in it's entirety, but even they don't go so far as to implement it's punishments - whether it's because most are illegal by today's standards I'm not sure! I'd ask my mother in law but I don't dare give her any impression that I'm interested in converting or I'll never get any peace :p

Enigma
11-06-04, 02:29 AM
Erm, okay I'm still off topic but I have to get something clear; so no one follows the Old Testament? Only (as mentioned by Moonie) "Jehovah's Witnesses" ?

MoonChild
11-06-04, 02:35 AM
Christians "believe" in it - that all of the things happened like Creation, the Flood, Moses and all that - but aren't bound by the laws & penalties as I mentioned above. The 10 Commandments are still quite popular though :)

i hope that is clearer...

Enigma
11-06-04, 02:39 AM
Moonie I'm going to bother you a bit today, can't help it, I'm really interested in this. :p

You said they aren't bound by laws & penalties

Why is that?

And can I ask why the New Testament was formed and the Old was left behind?

X-press
11-06-04, 02:53 AM
Enigma, the Old Testament, which is the Torah, was written for the jews. They do not follow the New Testament which is a collection of books central to Christianity only.

As there are so many sects within Christianity, I can't tell you for sure if all of them follow entirely the New Testament without altering some parts.

Enigma
11-06-04, 03:02 AM
Well see, I found this table while looking up something in the dictionary online; and it shows that the Old Testament ISN'T the Torah, it just includes the Torah:

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=bible

X-press
11-06-04, 03:06 AM
[size=1]Originally posted by Enigma
...why the New Testament was formed and the Old was left behind? [size]

Enigma, the New Testament contains books writen after the time of Prophet Jesus (pbuh), while the Old Testament, which is originally in Hebrew, is called like that to differenciate the books writen before the time of Jesus.

Though Old and New Testament form the Bibles, I understood that Jews doesn't recognize the name of Old Testament and called it the Torah.

MoonChild
11-06-04, 03:28 AM
Originally posted by Enigma
You said they [aren't bound by laws & penalties]

Why is that?

And can I ask why the New Testament was formed and the Old was left behind?

I'm not sure exactly what book/verse it is, but Jesus said "I come to fulfill the law", which is interpreted to mean that He released believers from the OT laws, and introduced the more general "do unto others" rule ... some Christians feel a little superior about it - in effect, as if the Jews were like little children who needed every behavior and the consequences for misbehavior spelled out for them... while Jesus taught a "more mature" practice of using one's own judgement, of course within the bounds of being loving and ethical.

The Old Testament hasn't been left behind - NO church that I know of has dropped it and uses the NT exclusively - but the laws are seen as historical, not currently applicable.

True Christianity is about, above all, treating everyone as if they were Jesus Himself - that is, to be loving, moral, fair and ethical in all your dealings with every person - and "release" from the old laws means that each person uses their own judgement in how to carry out "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" in their everyday lives.

X-press
11-06-04, 04:18 AM
Enigma, The torah is Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy.

If I am not mistaken, when Christians talk about the Old Testament, they mainly focus on the old scriptures which are the direct revelations of God to Prophet Moses (pbuh). These revelations is found in the 5 books (detail above) and make the Torah.

Usually the Christians will only focus on God's Laws and not on anything outside these 5 books, which are the stories of the prophets or books (psalms, songs, proverbs..) written by prophets that are not direct prophecies. These 'additions" can be compared to 'stories of the prophets' and 'Hadiths'.

IceTea
11-06-04, 08:56 AM
Enigma, you have opend two thread based on the thread which I started "cut off hands", we could discuss all the issues in that thread in the same thread. :rolleyes:

monotheism
16-06-04, 07:24 PM
True Christianity is about, above all, treating everyone as if they were Jesus Himself - that is, to be loving, moral, fair and ethical in all your dealings with every person - and "release" from the old laws means that each person uses their own judgement in how to carry out "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" in their everyday lives.

Instead of G-d, Who is all-perfect, deciding and prescribing how to be moral, how to tell right from wrong, man, who is highly fallible, is "freed" to decide that?!

monotheism
16-06-04, 07:36 PM
These revelations are found in the 5 books (detail above) and make the Torah.

According to Jews, the Torah consists of the 24 Books of Hebrew Scripture aka the Written Law, and the teachings of the Jeiwsh Sages, aka the Oral Law--known as such because it was originally transmitted orally.

The Torah also includes the Noahide Code, which are the G-d-given laws of proper moral conduct for all mankind. It has been faithfully preserved in the Oral (i.e. Rabbinic) Law. Only by scrupulously following its instructions, as expounded by contemporary Rabbinic authorities, can man attain a meaningful and intimate relationship with G–d. This uplifts him to experience inner tranquillity, material blessings and eternal life.

MoonChild
16-06-04, 08:18 PM
Originally posted by monotheism
Instead of G-d, Who is all-perfect, deciding and prescribing how to be moral, how to tell right from wrong, man, who is highly fallible, is "freed" to decide that?!

I'm not passing judgement on it, just stating my understanding of the reason why Christians' don't follow the the judaic law anymore.

monotheism
17-06-04, 06:07 PM
whew