"Two sensational murder cases in Oman involving two Western women have been referred to the grand mufti for a final decision on their fate, which could include a death sentence."

Quoted from Aljazeera.net (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/A66B6600-A6A2-4F68-94EB-43D023E5AF1D.htm)

Sunday 09 May 2004, 1:23 Makka Time, 22:23 GMT


An Omani criminal court reached a verdict on Saturday against Dana Gerlish, a German physiotherapist, and her wheelchair-bound Omani alleged lover – both in their 30s – were accused of murdering her father, according to a court source.

The prosecution had alleged that Gerlish, who pleaded not guilty to premeditated murder, decided to have her father killed because he opposed the relationship with her alleged lover, whose name has not been divulged in Omani media.

Gert Manfred Gerlish, 53, a car mechanic, was shot in the head at point blank range in Muscat's upmarket Qurum district in early December.

Mufti review

The verdict will only be made public on 17 July the source said, requesting anonymity.

Grand Mufti Shaikh Ahmad bin Muhammad al-Khalili has 60 days to "look into the case and give his opinion," before it can be publicised, the source added.

The mufti is authorised either to uphold the sentence or reduce it. He reviews such cases along with the sultanate's top two legal and criminal affairs advisors.

Referring a verdict to the grand mufti "is a normal procedure in cases where the death penalty is involved," the source said. "You can only deduce that it's the death penalty."



Husband killed

Minutes after the verdict was reached in the German's trial, the court made another confidential ruling in the case of an American accused of killing her husband.

The verdict against Rebecca Thompson, 43, will also be made public on 17 July.

Thompson's son by a previous marriage, William Derek Green, 14, and two 17-year-old Omani boys, were also charged in connection with the case. All three pleaded not guilty.

Oil worker Mark Lee Thompson was battered to death on 30 December last year and his body partly burnt.

During the trial, which concluded 21 April, Thompson's wife claimed she was provoked into hitting and killing her husband with an iron bar.

Defence lawyers hope "provisions of the penal code related to provocation" may reduce the wife's sentence to a year, a legal source said at the time.


@~ Do you believe that these two women deserved the death sentence or not?

@~ If their sentence is reduced, what do you think should be their punishment for the crimes they have committed?

They should be forced to life at hard labor working at Omantel.......that will be punishment enough......!!

No death penality.....two wrongs don't make right or bring back the victims.......



fatak

@~ Do you believe that these two women deserved the death sentence or not?
Yes, they acted as if they were owners of another human being life, and the motivations are not enough.
@~ If their sentence is reduced, what do you think should be their punishment for the crimes they have committed?
The whole life in prison, closed in one room forever, no type of contact with outside world.

Originally posted by X-press
[b]@~ Do you believe that these two women deserved the death sentence or not??[/color]

If they've committed crimes punishable by death then yes they deserve it. I don't think exceptions should be made because they're foreign. And the same should go for the Omanis involved as well.

Originally posted by X-press
[b]@~ If their sentence is reduced, what do you think should be their punishment for the crimes they have committed?[/color]

That's kinda difficult for us to decide. Law-makers are in a better position to decide this. I think they deserve a punishment that's proporationate to their crime. I'll leave it to the judges to decide what that is.

Does anyone know why the media has decided not to the name the Omanis involved when practically everyone in Oman knows who they are? :irk: Or is it fair to name and shame the foreigners (which, fair enough, many ppl would not recognise anyway) but not our own ppl :duh: A crime's a crime and there should be no exceptions to how those charged are treated. There may not be a verdict yet but the least they could've done is mention that they've been accused of whatever it is so others would think twice about even getting involved, in any shape or form, in anything dodgy.

If they actually were responcible for the death of others then of course they deserve the death sentence. no one.. no matter what.. has the right to take another human beings life to his/her own hands.

Originally posted by fatak
They should be forced to life at hard labor working at Omantel.......that will be punishment enough......!!

No death penality.....two wrongs don't make right or bring back the victims.......


:rolleyes: and who told you that working in Omantel meets the punishment thay deserves!!!


@~ Do you believe that these two women deserved the death sentence or not?
Yes!! they did a horrible crime and they should be punished for it!!

@~ If their sentence is reduced, what do you think should be their punishment for the crimes they have committed?
I dont think thier punishment should be reduced .. but then if it did .. it should be a life imprsionment ..

Originally posted by Diva
Does anyone know why the media has decided not to the name the Omanis involved when practically everyone in Oman knows who they are? :irk: Or is it fair to name and shame the foreigners (which, fair enough, many ppl would not recognise anyway) but not our own ppl :duh: A crime's a crime and there should be no exceptions to how those charged are treated. There may not be a verdict yet but the least they could've done is mention that they've been accused of whatever it is so others would think twice about even getting involved, in any shape or form, in anything dodgy.

Well the Omani government has announced anything at all about this case. All the information has been by external press. First an article in Gulf News last month which named the German woman, and the name was given to them by the German ambassador, and now this article in Al Jazeera. As far as the Omani government is concerned none of this should have been made public. You know how it is in Oman, the government keeps quiet until after the verdict and then they put an article in the paper giving names and some details.

If they are guilty then yes, they do deserve the death sentence. A life for a life.

@~ Do you believe that these two women deserved the death sentence or not?

No. I dont believe in "the death sentence" to begin with. I'd rather they spent their whole lives in prison. I mean killing someone because they killed someone is supposed to solve the problem? :lost: I know you are all gonna attack me now, but no one can change the way I think about this issue. I've had enough debates in class (almost ALL my class mates were against me :inno: )



@~ If their sentence is reduced, what do you think should be their punishment for the crimes they have committed?

Err... they should spend the rest of their lives in prison. That's fair enough.

------------

Btw, I know a lot of stuff about the second case. The guy who was murdered was working at my uncles company. A couple of weeks before his death, he was sitting at the same table as my mom, at my aunts wedding (yes, mixed :rolleyes: ). We actually have him on one of our video tapes and his wife looks so innocent. Oh well..!

i think anyone who kills..should be killed:shoot:

I doubt that either of them will be executed. Between pressure from their governments and international organizations like Amnesty International and human rights organizations who are against the death penalty, I think the sentences would probably be reduced to life.

But who'll publicly take the case of the Omanis?

in the first case, I just wounder why the Omani guy gave up everything and indulged himself in this crime!! I mean he had a good career and all!!

oh well .. people dont know how to think :rolleyes:

What I found peculiar in the first case is why a 30 years old women has to kill her father for the simple reason that he is opposed to her relationtionship.

I can remember if the Omani was the one who actually shot her father or if he was her accomplice and she did pull the trigger? It is indeed strange that the article doesn't mention anything about her lover if he was involved in this crime.

Originally posted by X-press
What I found peculiar in the first case is why a 30 years old women has to kill her father for the simple reason that he is opposed to her relationtionship.


what I know is this is not the reason..

Originally posted by Diva

Does anyone know why the media has decided not to the name the Omanis involved when practically everyone in Oman knows who they are? :

Well maybe not to spoil his (..fill in the blan...)name:lost:


As far as I heard from someone who is very close to this guy that him, and the other 2 Omani guys and the German girl are going to face death penalty...however they are still waiting for approval from the mufti and HM.

Originally posted by Arabian Princess
what I know is this is not the reason..


Same here

I think it is ridiculous to believe that a German woman needs her father's approval to get married. It's even more ridiculous to believe she'd kill him because he refuses to let her marry.

Since when did Europeans care for parents' approval when getting married?

Originally posted by Arabian Princess
in the first case, I just wounder why the Omani guy gave up everything and indulged himself in this crime!! I mean he had a good career and all!!



AP it seems that you know the guy.

Yes both should be excuted.

the 2 boys don't deserve to die
they were good ppl
n theyr underage

Southstar,

I agree that they're young, but they're still two "good people" who beat a middle-aged man they didn't even know with an iron bar, put him in the trunk of their car, threw him in a ditch, beat him some more, then poured petrol over him and burned him. Not nice.

But in answer to Mrs Prsss's questions:

Death Penalty?: No. Killing seven more people (the four Omanis who actually did the killing, the other Omani and two foreigners who conspired - not counting the 14 year old kid) will achieve what exactly? I am totally against the death penalty in any circumstance: I we believe that no man has the right to arbitrarily take life, then no court has either. It is primitive behaviour.

Alternative?: Depends on how you see the purpose of a sentence, i.e. retribution or reform? If it's retribution, then a life in jail seems the most appropriate alternative. But I prefer the reform approach: At which point will these people be suitably chastened, repentant, reformed and returable to normal society? Unfortunately I don't think there's enough attention paid to re-educating prisoners (spirituallty, socially and psychologically I mean) in Oman (or in my country for that matter).

So that just leaves punishment then. In which case, assuming they're guilty as described, I'd give the under-aged killers ten years (juvenile facility for the first few), the mature killers and the conspirators twenty, and the young kid 5 years in a juvenile facility. All of the above should leave them eligible for parole after 2/3 or 1/2 of the sentence, based on behaviour, reform and demonstrable remorse etc.

If they actually were responcible for the death of others then of course they deserve the death sentence. no one.. no matter what.. has the right to take another human beings life to his/her own hands.

Nabhan. surely thats a contradiction? If no man has the right to take the life of another what right do we or anyone to decide that the life of these people should be taken. 2 wrongs as they say do not make a right!

I dont believe in the death penalty atall. not for any crime.

The right of justice grasshoppers ...and why 2 wrongs, why the second is to be considered wrong?

PS: nice to see you back :wave:

I don't believe that any human being has the right to take someone else's life, and once you do that, then I guess you deserve a punishment.

Killing them in return seems only right, but I don't really know, I'm not the type that finds killing people an easy thing to accept, even when they deserve it. The thing to keep in mind is that you need to look at the whole situation, what lead those women to do what they did, assess their mental states, etc.. Only when you've come to learn about the whole situation and have completely understood the circumstances can you make a judgment.

So I can't really tell you that they deserve to be killed, but surely punished.

p.s. lol amo, lets just hope that grassy sticks with us this time.:)

Thanks for the welcome back Amo and Doc i will try to stick around lol but you know me.

To answer your question. In view the killing of any human being is unlawful and wrong. It doesnt matter that a legal system says its ok to execute these people. None of us are god and have that power to decide if its right to decide if someone should die.

I agree with Mimo on this. Reform or Retribution. What is achieved by killing these people. Nothing is fixed by this. Sooner or later a similar crime will happen again and the killing of these people would have done nothing to prevent it.
We need to be spending more time looking at why our societys breed such actions and what we can do to change it.
If these people are executed then ok someone feels better about the revenge of it but im not aware of any religion or belief that says that we should seek revenge.

Just my opinion.

About Rebecca Thompson, American Embassy has requested to take the matter themselves, perhaps she'll endup with life sentence.

Out of curiousity would some tell me probably PM me, who's wheelchair bound guy. He looks to be icon in the country. :)

We have new terrorists in Oman "WOMEN" killing men ...

Sorry I had to say it .. Anyway I believe that there is a law a shariya one which states that the Christian faith or any other faith which is non- Muslim, Muslims can not implement death sentence to none Muslim when it concern both none Muslims killing each other since they have their own Laws .. But he can sentence her to serve time according to a civil law in conjunction with the criminal court but if its None Muslim Killing a Muslim there is as well another law ..

I am not sure ...

Originally posted by Cerulean
I mean killing someone because they killed someone is supposed to solve the problem? :lost:

Actually yeah because then the person who killed won't be able to kill again!! Even if someone's given a life sentence that doesn't mean that they'll spend the rest of their lives behind bars. So in addition to the high probability of being set free at some point, that person needs to be fed and taken care of and everything and that all costs money. I personally don't really have a problem with that but it's only fair to the family of the victim. Unless they decide to forgive the murderer themselves.

Originally posted by RareDiamond
Well maybe not to spoil his (..fill in the blan...)name:lost:

So someone loses their life and we're concerned about not ruining the reputation of the person who was somehow involved in the murder? Where's the justice?? Or is it just because he's from a known family? I bet if he was a regular Joe his name and picture would've been splashed on all the papers. If Oman has a policy of not announcing the names of the accused until proven guilty then fair enough. I just hope that when they do announce the names all those convicted are treated the same.

Diva,
i think theyr names are not 'splashed over all papers' because theres nothing to be gained from that, anyone who knew them would know what happened- anyone who didnt shouldnt care about who it was ..
because the name being written on the paper might satisfy the 'curiousity' of many ppl , i agree
but is it worth it? the mom of the person, the family of the person..imagine how they might feel reading about it like that..they might be 'murderers' but they still have family and friends who care about them and those ppl are more important than the 'strangers'
theyr names wern't written as an act of respect to they'r family, and i think oman is right in doing so because as we all know, it's a small place with ppl having even smaller minds, to ruin a whole family name by having a murderer in it is possible here, and its just not worth it.
the accused will be punished but the family does not need to be.

True Southstar. The family does suffer. But I think it's important to let other ppl know firstly because I think it's silly that such a big thing (big by Oman's standards) has happened and the authorities are trying to keep it secret. And also because then ppl would know that no matter who they are they won't get away with doing $hit. Ppl in Oman always complain that if you are a big person or have wasta you can get away with almost anything cuz you're considered above the law. There was a certain high-profile case about a couple of years ago that I'm sure the majority of ppl here are familiar with and even though the details of the case were publicised, quite a bit was kept secret. Now I'm not saying that every single little detail should be in the papers but just enough to show ppl that no one's above the law so ppl can have faith in the system. I thought I knew quite a lot about that particular case but was surprised to later find out that a lot of what I'd heard from ppl was not true (I don't know why since Oman's full of rumours).

Just my opinion.

yeah diva, RUMOURS are like everything in oman
and its a really bad habit so many ppl have that i refuse to be a part of!!! its something that really pisses me off! BIGTIME!!!!!!!!:angre:

Originally posted by grasshopper
Thanks for the welcome back Amo and Doc i will try to stick around lol but you know me.

We need to be spending more time looking at why our societys breed such actions and what we can do to change it.
If these people are executed then ok someone feels better about the revenge of it but im not aware of any religion or belief that says that we should seek revenge.



Yes do try to stay with us!:)

I think you're right when saying that we need to look at why such incidences do occur in our societies instead of just focusing on punishing.

But when such a crime is done, then what? Justice has to be done, and more than that, this punishment should be a way of intimidating others of what could happen before they commit such a huge mistake. If we kept ignoring this fact then we might be going through a down hill. Sometimes desperate measures require desperate actions. Yet like I said before, to prevent is a far better option than to just cure. Both should be going on together and should be working along the same line.