Reading quite a few verses, and comments by members on-board ... I was left with nothing, but to open up this thread.

If there indeed is a judgement day and No one but God can measure a man by his deeds, then why do Muslims think of themselves as executioners and kill others.

Others who -
* Don't believe in Islam
* Who convert from Islam to other religions
* For liking the west?
* For having anything to do with Israel and Jews?

Why can't people just leave it to God to punish or reward people?

I just realized, I didn't mention why I included in-security in the title.

Other religions like Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity, blah-blah-ism gives a normal thinking man, the option of converting to their religion and the free will of leaving their religion ... if they feel wise enough to do so.

Of course, trying to enlighten them about their own religion is quite normal.

But, taking one's sword and guns out ... and murdering a person for converting (actually leaving Islam) is not what a person would expect.

Leaves me to think ... Islam is indeed in-secure (not only Islam. I am mentioning just one). If God was all powerful, and almighty ... he wouldn't ask HIS people to kill those who leave Islam. He would have been wise to know, that if people truly felt Islam was right, then they would stick on.

Back to the 700 A.Ds? :bored:

ps/ AP, I know that there are many 'wrong' Muslims out there. My point is made to the general public.

Originally posted by Shinoda LP
Reading quite a few verses, and comments by members on-board ... I was left with nothing, but to open up this thread.

If there indeed is a judgement day and No one but God can measure a man by his deeds, then why do Muslims think of themselves as executioners and kill others.

Others who -
* Don't believe in Islam
* Who convert from Islam to other religions
* For liking the west?
* For having anything to do with Israel and Jews?

Why can't people just leave it to God to punish or reward people?

who told you that muslim thinks of executioners and killing others ?????

islam is the religion of the ease check this thread i am sure going to help you alot islam the religion of the Ease (http://www.englishsabla.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13073&highlight=islam+religion+of+the+ease)

who told you that muslim thinks of executioners and killing others ?????

* Islam started out with Muhammad and his troops massacring a whole village.
* Muslims (most) count Hezbollah and Hamas as 'good' groups, rather than thinking of 'Killing' as a wrong notion.
* Every now and then, news of people who are tortured and murdered for converting to another religion comes to the fore front.

These are few reasons why I posted that. I shall be on the look-out for interesting links too ;)

Originally posted by Shinoda LP
* Islam started out with Muhammad and his troops massacring a whole village.
* Muslims (most) count Hezbollah and Hamas as 'good' groups, rather than thinking of 'Killing' as a wrong notion.
* Every now and then, news of people who are tortured and murdered for converting to another religion comes to the fore front.

These are few reasons why I posted that. I shall be on the look-out for interesting links too ;)

every thing starts with reasons ..
for exampl, humas and others .. do u think of israel if they give lands back to their owners .. i dont think there 'll be any resisting against them ....

1 in 3 links, resulting from a google search for 'Extremism' are related to Islam and Muslims (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&safe=off&q=extremism)

Causes of Islamic terrorism (http://www.usip.org/peacewatch/2002/6/extremism.html) <- Wouldn't exist if there wasn't a problem to be adressed!

do u think of israel if they give lands back to their owners

You are talking more on terms of Nationality, than religion. Whose mistake it is, to mix religion and patriotism ... is not one of my worries, because I already know the answer.

I know about the atrocities of Jews on Muslims, and the other way around too. But, I still don't hate all Jews!
....

Another comment.

Whenever someone raises a question regarding the 'wrongs' of Islam, I have heard about 'its humans, people ... not Islam that is wrong'.

There is no 'correct' Islamic state. There is no 'correct' Muslim?

Why take things to your own d.amn hands, rather than leave it to Almighty God? Or do you feel a lack of supernatural support on the war?

:rolleyes:

Islam started out with Muhammad and his troops massacring a whole village.

Where is your historical prove ? I dont recall this incident unless i have a bad memory.

Muslims (most) count Hezbollah and Hamas as 'good' groups, rather than thinking of 'Killing' as a wrong notion

Defending our lands is one important islamic teaching

Every now and then, news of people who are tortured and murdered for converting to another religion comes to the fore front.

When a person knows the true path and then returns to his old sinful path should be punished in this world and in the afterworld.
Ofcourse they should not be punished by indivisuals, but when there is a government that would judge on him and would then sentence wheather he diserves being killed or no.

Its a good topic and you will insha Allah hear good replies. The question is, will you take the correct path if the answers were convinsing /?

Shinoda, how about we lay off the Islam bashing for awhile and just try to understand it :D

If there indeed is a judgement day and No one but God can measure a man by his deeds, then why do Muslims think of themselves as executioners and kill others.

We don't THINK of ourselves as anything but worshipers to Allah; and since Allah clearly asked us to punish those who (in some cases) then we will abide by it.

Others who -
* Don't believe in Islam
* Who convert from Islam to other religions
* For liking the west?
* For having anything to do with Israel and Jews?

1.Don't believe in Islam:

Muslim's don't kill people who don't believe in Islam, they kill people who refuse to accept it as a religion.....On the contrary, it's written in the Quran that a muslim should respect other religions and treat it's followers well.

2. Convert to from Islam:

Well why? Because it is the belief that apostates are out to sin;
"If you renounced the faith, you would surely do evil in the land, and violate the ties of blood." (Sura 47:23)

3. Liking the west:

Ok....first of all I've NEVER heard of someone being executed just cause they liked the west :duh: don't make rash assumptions. But if you want to ask why muslims don't like people who like the west well.........what do they like about it? If what they like is harmless and doesn't go against Islam (like westerner's freedom maybe?) then there is nothing wrong with that....but if it is something against Islam; why would a follower like it?

4. Have anything to do with Israel or Jews:

Shinoda, what are they doing to us? Pick up your **** newspaper and see what's happening in Palistine and then come tell me that we shouldn't hold anything against Jewish/Isralies!

Its a good topic and you will insha Allah hear good replies. The question is, will you take the correct path if the answers were convinsing /?

Thank you. If it is converting to Islam, that you're expecting from me ... no. I believe in doing good deeds, and not expecting a whole lot ... and I'll stick to that.

...

Enigma (How surprising?!)

they kill people who refuse to accept it as a religion

What's free will? I thought God gave man free will, but only to use it wisely. Guess the people of the right religion, mis-use it in the first place.

If you renounced the faith, you would surely do evil in the land, and violate the ties of blood

Being quite practical, doesn't that sound like some reverse engineering was done, to come up with that smart meaningful reason?

Pick up your **** newspaper and see what's happening in Palistine

For Christs sake, there are problems in a dozen other countries. You only cry about one? Palestine? Just because Palestine's filled with Muslims? What does Humanity stand for? It hasn't narrowed down to being-Islam, as yet!! :duh:

Gwanta,

Where is your historical prove ?

If you're expecting it to be written down in the Quran, I am sorry.

Taken from:Prophet Muhammad and terroristic mass murders (http://www.dcregistry.com/forums/religion/messages/1841.html)

At that time there were in Medina three Jewish tribes. Two of them, the Qaynqa and the Bani-al-Nudair tribes, were besieged by Mohammed’s men, blocking their access to food supplies, until they surrendered on Mohammed’s terms, which were that their lives would be spared, that they must emigrate from Medina, and that they must deposit all their belongings at a certain place for distribution among Muslims.

.
.

Mohammed, however, would not consent to this, and instead appointed as an arbiter Saad iben Moaz, a man who was known to be on bad terms with Bani Qurayza. Saad ruled that all Bani Qurayza’s men should be beheaded, that the women and children should be sold as slaves, and that all their property should be divided among the Muslims.

Trenches were dug in the bazaar of Medina for disposal of the nine hundred Jewish bodies whom Mohammed had spent the night slaughtering. (See Ibn Hisham: The Prophet’s Biography: vol 2 pages 40&41.)


I guess that's good enough for now. A war was waged. Muhammad did the same thing, as Hitler did. Hitler was hated, unlike what happened to the earlier.

For Christs sake, there are problems in a dozen other countries. You only cry about one? Palestine? Just because Palestine's filled with Muslims? What does Humanity stand for? It hasn't narrowed down to being-Islam, as yet!!

Am I crying about it?! I gave you a perfecltly suitable reason for muslims to dislike Jews. That's it!

Since you're a Muslim, do you hate Jews?

Originally posted by Shinoda LP
Since you're a Muslim, do you hate Jews?


No I don't HATE them but I'm not exactly fond of them either. :duh:

That's the point.

You, as a Muslim, have a notion embedded into your brain that Jews are not good people.

Me and others, of other religions ... respect people according to what they do, rather than being brain-washed through their teenage life.

....

That aside, the point of this thread being ... Aren't all these verses, quotes from Quran/Hadeeth etc calling out to Muslims to kill people who do wrongs a symbol of in-security, within Islam?

If God was all powerful, why would he want mere mortals to kill mean men? Rather than he doing it Himself.

Kinda negated the idea of the presence of God, in the first place.

Mr. Shinoda LP,
My humble request to you, without knowing about Qur’an,Prophet Mohammed (Pbuh) please do not pass any comments like an ignorant.

Shamsery, instead of confirming to us that you are indeed ignorant, why don't you try an disprove the author of this thread with logic, facts and figures instead of the usual sticking the fingers in the ears and screaming 'lalalalalalalalalalala' ?

By Shinoda LP "For Christs sake"

Just a comment, i thought u're a hindu or Budhist (sorry if am mistaken). Are u saying that u beleive in christ or was that just something u learnt from wherever u live right now.

Thank you. If it is converting to Islam, that you're expecting from me ... no. I believe in doing good deeds, and not expecting a whole lot ... and I'll stick to that.

So this means that there is no point what so ever to argue with you since you are not looking for the right path, but rather you are here to talk not listen. Do i call this ignorance ?

As for the juews then please wait until im back from uni.

Shinoda, did you even experienced a muslim coming to you with a gun i his hand (oh to make it more dramatic what about a sword) and asked to convert or he will kill you?? after all you livied many years in Oman, a muslim country!!!

and from where did you confirm your thoughts, from an article called: the ugly history of Islam!! what would you expect to get from an artlicle like this!!


Prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) never killed a soul. They went to wars YES, but each war has its own reason and historical background. The ibn Quraydha war for example have a long story behind it, muslims didnt enter a war with them just for the sake of spreading Islam!!
Prophet Mohammed himslef used to trade with Jews, if muslims were asked to kill them how would that possibly happen!!

Hammas and Islam Jihad have thier motives behind thier wars. They have a reason .. might not be clear to you because you are not there in the battle field. They are not fighting to spread Islam, they are fighting to free thier land!

One question SLP, whats the punishment of a person who commits treason?

Originally posted by Shinoda LP
[B]....why do Muslims think of themselves as executioners and kill others.

I don't how you came to such a conclusion Shinoda! As far as I know they are more non-muslims killing, raping, robbing each others in western countries than all muslims combined!

Why don't you ask all these criminals, sex offenders, thiefs etc why they did what they did and didn't leave it to God?

Originally posted by Shinoda LP

I guess that's good enough for now. A war was waged. Muhammad did the same thing, as Hitler did. Hitler was hated, unlike what happened to the earlier.
To be more logical it's better to derive ur iformation from Islamic sites like this one http://www.geocities.com/islamicmessage/lopm/chptr21.htm instead of citing information from anti-islamic sites :lost: :tiered:

I'll reply as soon as time permits.

Sorry for the wait ;)