To day is 28th March. My father was shot to death by Pakistani invaders on the day in the year 1971.We observe the day with due respect and offer prayer for his departing soul. We feel ourselves proud that our father sacrificed his life for the cause of freedom.
So, we evaluate the word “Freedom” “Liberation” from the deferent angel than Bush Blair does.
Aggression on you is much more worst and naked than Pakistanis did.
Iraq is the first gulf state that diplomatically recognizes us. Our people are grateful to you and will never forget that kind act.
To day we are proud for you. You have lodged a potential resistance against the aggressors to up hold your sovereignty. I salute your nationalist sprit. I don’t know how long you will be able to resist these devils.
At the dawn of 21st century, I assure you that your name will be embalmed in the page of history. By sacrificing your life, you have teaches the week nation and small countries how to stand against neo- imperialist axis. It has a long-term impact. Small countries and week nations are to take lesson from you. You have proved that the unity of the common people is how far essential.
I solemnly declare that you have won the political and moral battle. This is absolute victory. So long the civilization will prevail you will be remembered with honor, dignity.
We are ashamed; we could not be your co-fighter. Except leaf service we could not do anything for you, we could not perform our duties. Perhaps history will not excuse us.
With a heavy heart, once again I salute your sprit and wish you all the luck.

In 1971 India came to the defence of Bangladesh (then known as East Pakistan) against Pakistani aggression.

In 1991 the US and UK (among others) came to the defence of Kuwait against Iraqi aggression.

In 1971 Pakistan was ruled by a despot. In 1991 Iraq was ruled by a despot.

The difference is that Iraq is still ruled by a despot.

The US and UK intend to rid the world of Saddam. When that has happened, Kuwaitis and Iraqis will live in peace and freedom.

I'm surprised that you, of all people, don't support that.

The difference is that Iraq is still ruled by a despot.

are you saying that Pakistan has democracy now?????

the real difference now is the US is getting greedy and want to improve their economy by long term control of the iraqi oil.
that's why they're not doing anything about the despot who rules Pakistan and has WMD including nuclear capabilities.

"are you saying that Pakistan has democracy now?????"

If I wanted to say that Pakistan had a democracy now I would say it.

"the real difference now is the US is getting greedy"

The US has been greedy for a long time. However, the US does not need to take long term control of Iraqi oil. The US has good relations with many Arab countries. They provide oil, the US provides security and weapons. The US is in Iraq now precisely because they want to continue to provide security to Arab allies, which involves putting renegades like Saddam in his place.

Originally posted by Mephistopheles
The US is in Iraq now precisely because they want to continue to provide security to Arab allies

your jokes never stop to amuse me.

you gave two examples of pakistan an iraq and didn't wanna answer the question why the US is not in pakistan. simple answer is; there is fu** all in pakistan. no money.

"why the US is not in pakistan"

Pakistan has not USED weapons of mass destruction.

Our war of independence was for self-determination. We fought our war and America was against it. Indeed, we got support and help from India. Do you think same thing is happening in Iraq? Do you think that the allied forces have come to impose democracy on Iraqi people? Can Democracy exported? WMD?? How long it is with Iraq? Who supplied it to Iraq? Why don’t you live Iraq to Iraqis?

"Our war of independence was for self-determination"

Iraqis also deserve self-determination.

"Do you think that the allied forces have come to impose democracy on Iraqi people? "

The war against Saddam is the first step on the road to democracy for Iraqis.

"Who supplied it to Iraq?"

The key to WMD is that they should be used as a threat for defensive purposes. Many countries have them. Only Saddam has used them.

"Why don’t you live Iraq to Iraqis?"

There are 4 million Iraqis who have fled from the Saddam regime. Many 10s of thousands have been killed by him. Many, many thousands of Iraqis support the war on Saddam.

I myself fled from the then East Pakistan and took arms against the Pakistani aggressors. Few hundred thousand also fled away. We are indebted to India, we fought our own battle. India did not fight on behalf of us.
Please provide some valid points so we can correct our mistake.
Is there any instance in the history that occupation forces has given democracy, true liberation to the defeated nation? Are they going to create new history? Mean while they have set up an administration with a retired General to run the administrative show in post-war Iraq. Are they Iraqi?

Originally posted by shamsery
Is there any instance in the history that occupation forces has given democracy, true liberation to the defeated nation? Are they going to create new history?

Of course there is. The victorious Allies gave democracy and true liberation to a large number of European states after WWII.

....to say nothing of Japan and numerous ex-colonies of the British Empire that now enjoy democracy and membership of the Commonwealth, including, for example, India.

Also including a vast number of African and Middle Eastern countries who are still striving to enjoy the benefits of democracy in their idiosyncratic way.

Also including, for example, the Philappines, which used to be a colony of the United States, and most of South East Asia, which used to be British colonies.

So, to recap.

Apart from most of Europe, most of South East Asia, most of the Middle East, most of Africa, most of the Near East, Japan, oh and not-forgetting-the-Republic-of-Ireland, yes, you're absolutely correct.

One should also not forget the smaller Indian and Pacific Ocean nations, such as The Seychelles, Maldives, Fiji, Tonga and The Pitcairn Islands - all of whom bask in the benefits of democracy. Then there are the Caribbean islands.

Shakey,

I almost forgot Canada, New Zealand and Australia, to say nothing of Indonesia and Borneo.

I feel that a renewed recap is called for.

So, Shamsery, apart from almost the whole world, yes, you are correct.

:gap: :gap:

LOL !

:gap: :gap:

“to say nothing of Japan and numerous ex-colonies of the British Empire that now enjoy democracy and membership of the Commonwealth, including, for example, India.”
Very interesting information. Who fought for the liberation of Indian and Japanese people?
Against whom? When?


Perhaps my knowledge in history is very poor.

Sanwin,
Please comment.

"Who fought for the liberation of Indian and Japanese people?"

They didn't have to fight. We gave it to them, because that's the kind of people we are.

Originally posted by Mephistopheles
"Who fought for the liberation of Indian and Japanese people?"

They didn't have to fight. We gave it to them, because that's the kind of people we are.



That is RUBBISH thing to say

Originally posted by Mephistopheles
"why the US is not in pakistan"

Pakistan has not USED weapons of mass destruction.

Yeah right.What were they doing in India then?What are those pakistani's doing in Kashmir now?Arent they using weapons of mass destruction?

They too like Iraq and North Korea have weapons of mass destructions.Why dont Us go behind them?Oh wait their turn will come.First in the list is Iraq.Then Korea.Then Somalia(the black hawk revenge),then whatever other "terrorist" nation in Africa.From there its back to Arab state Kuwait,then its Pakistan and India and from there all other states of Asia one by one.Then from there its the europian states,and lastly but not the least UNITED KINGDOM.United States have lots of guts just to think about ruling the world.

It is? Then I suggest you return to your history books.

After WW2 Japan was governed for a while by the US while they established democratic institutions.

Democratic elections were then held and the US left.

After WW2 the British left India. Indians had wanted independence for some time, culminating in Gandhi's peaceful protests. It was a near "blood-free" transfer of power.

Originally posted by Mephistopheles
After WW2 the British left India. Indians had wanted independence for some time, culminating in Gandhi's peaceful protests. It was a near "blood-free" transfer of power.

The British had ruled India for 100 years.They left because they were pressured to do so.Please read your history books before telling others to do so.

"blood-free2 transfer of power"????:lost: Can you highlight that sentence once again please?

Of COURSE Indians wanted self-rule! They asked for it, the British gave it to them!

"Blood-free" means that there was no war, no revolution, barely even any civil unrest.

barely even any civil unrest


Until after Britain departed, after which Hindus and Muslims have been at each other´s throats incessantly.

Originally posted by Shakoosh Kabir
barely even any civil unrest


Until after Britain departed, after which Hindus and Muslims have been at each other´s throats incessantly.


Very much so like the Catholics and the Protestant in the Northern Ireland where the British weight leans over the Catholics against the Protestants. And the least to mention Cyprus where again the British are siding with the Greek against the Turkish Cypriots as they do against the Israeli and siding with the Palestinians.


take us back to the topic please. Shamsery's confession applies to anyone Arab a stigma to live with till end of time

"in the Northern Ireland where the British weight leans over the Catholics against the Protestants"

The Northern Ireland problem exists because there are more Protestants than Catholics. The Protestants want to remain British, the Catholics want to be part of the Rpeublic of Ireland.

It's a question of numbers. When Catholics outnumber Protestant, they will no doubt want to hold a referendum enabling NI to become part of Ireland. In the meantime, Britain has no choice but to defend the interests of the majority, who want to remain British.

Re Cyprus, Cyprus has been independent since the 1950s. How they manage their affairs is entirely their own business. Unless, of course, they build their own WMD.....

"a stigma to live with till end of time"

The stigma that you hold is that you still defend a murderous regime.

Originally posted by Mephistopheles


1:

The Northern Ireland problem exists because there are more Protestants than Catholics.

2:

It's a question of numbers.

3:

When Catholics outnumber Protestant, they will no doubt want to hold a referendum enabling NI to become part of Ireland.

4:

In the meantime, Britain has no choice but to defend the interests of the majority,


Is, "more"; "numbers"; "outnumber"; "majority", a criteria recognized by the British public least to speak of official policy ?
So the standard in NI changes the laws of minority from the cause roots. Why is it so different elsewhre ?


This is crazy even a one year old baby would despute the logic

The problem here is the false perception that the Northern Ireland situation and the Israeli/Palestinian situation and the Greek/Turkish Cypriot situation are comparable insofar as they all involve "religious" conflict. Balderdash. The problem in each case is primarily political. I know Irish Protestants who are Irish citizens and Irish Catholics who are British citizens. Likewise, many Palestinian Christians would prefer Israeli Jews over their Muslim brothers.

Dear Abs,
British ruled India about 200 years.
From 1757 to 1947.
History of indepence of India is bloody and long.
It was not a gift.

Dear DS,
Please don’t treat my confession as disgrace for the Arab people. ( Though I have doubt, does they have such feelings?)
I just expressed my honest feelings and my inabilities.
I am afraid that the war can take another dimension.
The sentiment, which I have observed in Bangladesh, is it’s a war between Muslim and Christian. Our common people are thinking in that way. Some fanatic people are trying hard to focus it in that way.
It’s not a war between any religions. Look at Indonesia, Malaysia, and Pakistan. (All are non-Arab countries)
Same sentiment you will observe.
Neither Bush Blair is a religious person (They have ignored the appeal Pope Jon Paul) nor the Iraqi bath party is an Islamic party. It’s a pro soviet secular party. Yes, at the moment they are reciting from holly Qur’an very often and trying to color the war as Jihad. In my consideration, it’s a good tactics to earn the sympathy of Muslim world. (Saddam has failed to unite Arabs). I also understand, what else he can do?
The Islamic fundamentalist groups will be much more stronger all over the world and they will earn people sympathy.
After 1970, I have never witness such great spontaneous concern of our people. You will not find a single person in Bangladesh who dares to support Bush and Blair openly. Every day there is rally all over the Bangladesh against Anglo American axis. Though our Government has not take clear stand against Bush administration.

Originally posted by shamsery
Dear Abs,
British ruled India about 200 years.
From 1757 to 1947.
History of indepence of India is bloody and long.
It was not a gift.

Thankyou shamsery.I hope Mephistopheles read this.

Thank you too.

"British ruled India about 200 years."

Indeed, Shamsery, and a golden period it was too. And when India was ready for self rule, the British moved out.

How bloody was the fight for Indian Independance Shams ? Not too much. THe blood spilled was not due to fighting the Brits. It was between Hindu's and Muslims.

Not only do you not know much about Bangladeshi history, you are equally weak with Indian historyy.

Is it true the British left India after realising there was nothing more to steal from precious stones ?

Originally posted by Desert_Sloath
Is it true the British left India after realising there was nothing more to steal from precious stones ?

They tried to steal their Food recipies but couldn’t cook according to the book ..That’s why you find them in cheap Indian Restaurants to tastes the Indian jolly good food.

Funny this world .. You may steal so many things but somethings can not be stolen ..

sanwin25,
This is surprise? As you are from this sub-continent, must be knowing the history of India (1757-1947).
You don’t find anything except Hindu and Muslim conflict. British also rooted this conflict.

You tell me.

But facts please. Not some ramblings which you believe to be true.

BTW, still waiting for you on the other threads.

Mr.Sanwin 25,
This thread is related with Iraq. Please open a thread on the liberation movement of greater India. I will try my best to contribute my knowledge and idea. Previously I also informed you that I can not give much time in sabla. Let us discuss here on My confession to the Iraqis.
Regarding the other thread I am concerned with the comments only, which you used about us. We shall discuss the matter their.
Thanks.

For the kind attention of Mr.Sanwin25.

What are you looking for ?

Originally posted by sanwin25
What are you looking for ?


He wants you to tell of a secret about the coincidence of British legacy in India vis a vis creation of Israel state amidst the arabs in the 'Sham' in 1947/8 ?

sanwin25 you are an expert of some sort at inflaming religious wars and as a historian why don't you give shamsery a lesson for good ?

don't feel ashamed he probably already knows where you belong right now !!

c`mon engage him on revolutionary history by opening a thread. are you afraid of him being a military historian sort of ?

More than a year back on 28-03-03 I initiated the thread.
By now we have come to the conclusion about WMD.
Now we are to wait for withdrawal of the troops and how American exported democracy goes in Iraq market.

Corruption

"Wastage by the public sector costs Bangladesh $1.38bn a year and the worst offenders are the public sector gas, petroleum and power industries, Mr Huran agreed.

For example, the local press has reported corrupt deals to supply gas illegally to slum dwellers by staff at the Titas Gas Distribution Co.

Embezzlement of revenue from gas supplies running on these illicit pipelines are "one of the most serious problems facing the company," the firm's managing director told the local Independent newspaper.

In addition to improving tax collection and cracking down on corruption, Bangladeshis need to alter their mindset, the finance minister said. "

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1957437.stm


Bangladesh shouldn't get any more foreign aid. 33 years of other countries donating money should have been more than enough to get them established and self-sufficient.

Pull the plug. Let them make it on their own. Welfare recipients always grow resentful and ungrateful.

Iraq will be able to do in 5 years what Bangladesh could not accomplish in 30.

What is the difference between them that woudl account for this ?

Proverbs goes birds of a feather flock together.

I couldn’t find any connection of your reply with the thread, Mr. Wonderer.
Iraq is a recourse full country.
Holding 2nd biggest oil stock.
We are nothing to them.
Why you are there,please?