Teacher: "fulan, whats your 7 times table?"
student: " 1 times 7 is seven
2 times 7 is 14.....until..7 times 9 is..ah? ah? ma3refesh!"
Teacher: "u DON'T know !!!!!!!!!! ?#@&%! "

Teacher spanking student with whatever comes in handy. say, chair's foot...ruler...hmm, el firgaar?....anything nice and solid

Ouch :(

so, i guess the question is, was that abuse? and should kids be spanked in schools....i mean common, he didn't learn his times table !

NO WAY.

I strongly disagree with this spanking method at schools and yes its abuse. I remember those who used to get this kind of punishment and really felt sorry for them. It made them even worse and disbelieved in their own abilities beside developing a weak personality. Psychologists have proven this a long time ago but some teachers in Oman still implement this silly technique at our schools. Any teacher who do this must knows that students don’t like him and wont show any respect to him outside the school because they only afraid of his stick

Parents are the people who might punish a child using a stick which shouldn't be very hurtful while he/she is away from his/her friends. However, they could latter on explain why they did that and just hug him/her, next time he/she will think hardly before doing the same mistake.

i know u are right about this, but i can't help but think that,us, the older generation who got the spanking are better mannered and better taught. Maybe there was something right with the old system. I feel there should be some form of disciplinary act that a teacher should be able to take (withing limits ofcourse).
tara remember, with all due respect, but el kird fi 3yoon umaah daymen wu abadan, '3azaal.
So, the school is always wrong...and the kid gets away with it. wla keyf?

sorry its long :)

I always hear my friends saying that the generations who finished schools during early 90s were much better than those who are currently at high schools. I am not quite sure that this is very true but let me assume that its true. The question will be is it because of the old system??

I DON’T THINK SO.

You got to know my friend that our country is growing so fast and every year we have new changes not like the developed countries who have already settled down. These changes don’t just include the country infrastructure but also the cultural changes through the emerge of satellites, mobile phones, Internet, and other new technologies. Many examples can demonstrate my argument and here are some examples.

1. Enter Oman room in mIRC chat and see how many people are there every night (something like 200-300). Five years ago we don't even have the internet in Oman. The large scale of communication and ideas sharing between those people -who are more likely to be aged between 15 to 25- may influence their life, let alone the time consuming.

2. Visit a small town in the interior of Oman and pick any neighborhood, count how many dishes (satellite plate) are there and how there were five years ago. Let alone bigger cities like Muscat or Salalah.

3. Imagine how many students finished the 3rd secondary in 1995 and what was the percentage of those who stayed at home after that. On the other hand compare the same statistics with 2000 figures. Do you expect average students to care about study and have positive look at society when they just been told that 80% of them will end up with only General Secondary Certificate.

I hope these examples have meant something!!!

I am 22 and I will never ever blame teenagers for what they have been put through.

U will never blame teenagers for what they've been put through.

Ok..fair enough.

i read your points, and yes, i do realise that everything is intra-related. But but but, whats this got to do with NOT blaming the teenagers?
what? bcz they r kids?
well toughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Then what do we call the 9 and 12 year olds who die evrey day in plaestine? lets go global, shall we. What about the iraqi kids? if we keep pampering our kids and creating "excuses" for them, then surely they will always remain kids. Isn't it time they grew up and stop giving their parents & government a hard time. I mean, what excuse is there for the boys who hang around in a gang and get into fights? i remember that our kids once upon a time used to study hard to get out of the tough life they had.....for example, go to the interior places? they r becoming less interested in education....

They had a hard life, complained...kil shay fi muscat. Ok, gilna ha, life became easier.....kamaan galu mashay minah.
I have a theory, if u really have an aim....u'll do it...poor or rich. The parents and government r not totally right ....but neither are our children. They r growing up by the day (Allah y'7ali el shawarma will french fries) and its time they stand up for their own mistakes. How long should a mother keep carrying the sins of her children, its enough she had him/shim for 9 months. I say, its time they grew up. U want to be treated like a grown up, then act like one !

First off all thank you for keeping the discussion alive and I am intended here to provide some answers to you queries.

1. your first query “...But but but, whats this got to do with NOT blaming the teenagers?...’
read your introductory thread and will find out that we are discussing students at school who are either children or teenagers. I was trying to demonstrate that the teacher or society could be the ones to blame for students failure therefore why spanking them when its not their faults.

2. your second query “....what? bcz they r kids?...”
“kids” isn't the answer! the answer was provided in my last post. Well, actually you provided some answers like the peace situation in a country which has major influence in personalities. ....At the present circumstances, don't expect an Omani kid to be as brave as a Palestinians who saw his dad or sister get killed..

3. your third question “....well toughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Then what do we call the 9 and 12 year olds who die evrey day in plaestine? lets go global, shall we. What about the iraqi kids?...”

I call them brave kids who saw the tough life, they are really growing up in difficulties. I am sure if an Omani kid grow in similar situations he/she will be just like them.

I am not making excuses for anybody, in fact releasing the pressure from the back of those teenagers and accepting the fact that we as “parents” “society” “teachers”...etc have a major impact on how these kids are going to be thinking.

4’.....They r growing up by the day (Allah y'7ali el shawarma will french fries) and its time they stand up for their own mistakes. How long should a mother keep carrying the sins of her children, its enough she had him/shim for 9 months. I say, its time they grew up. U want to be treated like a grown up, then act like one !....”

No comments in this one.

Same thanks to u nzwani for your response. I'm sorry if my reply sounded a bit too strong, but its merely frustration about this issue not frustration on u or any other reader, so the last "no comment" point was "isloob ta3ajub al '3arath minu el su'7riya", u know, basically laughing when reaching a dead end, cos thats all one can do.

o.k, now, i said:
1. your first query “...But but but, whats this got to do with NOT blaming the teenagers?...’

u said:
read your introductory thread and will find out that we are discussing students at school who are either children or teenagers. I was trying to demonstrate that the teacher or society could be the ones to blame for students failure therefore why spanking them when its not their faults.

but now, i say:
indeedo. plz understand my point, i am not generalising here...not all teachers are great, nor parents...but also, not all kids r great either. Maybe this discussin has come out of its way a bit, but thats how it normally does usually. Everything is relating to anything.
I am one of the many once-upon-a-time-teenagers who suffered so called "abuse" from my teachers, but i wish not to call it abuse, nor keep going over it, coz it doesn't help u move on as an individual.

So, basically, i was trying to say:
Parents r to blame for spoiling their kids. Just look at these new mums today. The kid falls, "ooh maskeen"...common, let the child experience pain. If u can't tolerate the small stings when u're a baby, how can u take the bigger ones when u're left all alone in the "big bad world".

Teachers r not excused for hitting children the way they used to, but i think they should be given permission to some form of disciplinary act. In the UK, everything is abuse, its so bad that a child ALWAYS has an excuse, even for committing adultry. And its even wosre in the states. Do we want to reach to that stage? I'm not sure we won't some day.

Children. They have rights, but they must understand its a 2 way communication route, give & take. U don't give...then u don't take. I give a child love, security and rules, then i expect respect, love & obedience. But naah...we just give give give....or take take take. We have no such word as EQUILIBRIUM.

sorry, this is too long, but i have to finish this, also:

I said:
3. your third question “....well toughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Then what do we call the 9 and 12 year olds who die evrey day in plaestine? lets go global, shall we. What about the iraqi kids?...”

u said:
I call them brave kids who saw the tough life, they are really growing up in difficulties. I am sure if an Omani kid grow in similar situations he/she will be just like them.

and i say now:
why should we wait for that situation? why must we always be unprepared. Look at other countries who suffered war and r "considered" recovered. Look at Japan. Look at the syrians(as an arab example;)? very independent economically. If any war happens (GOd forbid) they won't suffer as much as we will. We are a very dependent nation.

The indians and philipinos r finding better places to work, better life, better education, why would they want to work in the gulf after that? who is gonna feed our poor lil kids. We need a plan. And nobody said its going to be an easy one.

sorry if its too long...i do hope that i did not get out of the subject.
thank u & salaamz.

Again and again, thank you very much for replying, your valuable comments are appreciated. No, you didn’t sound strong or anything, its just my pure way of discussing and arguing about an issue bearing in mind that different opinions only give the analog a better conclusion which will never damages the focal point. I don’t like to ignore any points and that why I ended up with “no comments” as I didn't want just to escape.I guess it was confusing a bit in that particular paragraph. Yes, we both went out from the main topic in many occasion so I leave it up to you to draw a final conclusion based on our previous posts.

But before that, I found my self again in a situation that shouldn’t be ignored so I’ll talk very briefly about your last reply. I am sorry, But I’d only go through some points to prevent repentance and redundancy.

1) “......So, basically, i was trying to say:
Parents r to blame for spoiling their kids. Just look at these new mums today. The kid falls, "ooh maskeen"...common, let the child experience pain. If u can't tolerate the small stings when u're a baby, how can u take the bigger ones when u're left all alone in the "big bad world".....”

That what I was aiming to reach, kids should only have a tiny part of the blame but the parents who spoils them should know that they are making a big mistake. By the way, I think it was in my first replay when I said that children should get some spanks from their parents. I only opposed what teachers do in front of the whole class.

2) “.....Children. They have rights, but they must understand its a 2 way communication route, give & take. U don't give...then u don't take. I give a child love, security and rules, then i expect respect, love & obedience. But naah...we just give give give....or take take take. We have no such word as EQUILIBRIUM.....”

3ala al3ain wa alras, Give a kid the chance by *love, security.....etc* and he/she will hopefully deliver the good behaviors. Again, Its parent’s duty to Fix the equation of give and take.

3) “..... and i say now:
why should we wait for that situation? why must we always be unprepared. Look at other countries who suffered war and r "considered" recovered. Look at Japan. Look at the syrians(as an arab ....”

What really make me think again and again that you always go in a very big scale. I am hoping that you are deeply realizing the sort of comparison that you are making
‘ such as Palestinians, Jaban situation, Iraq,,,,etc”. I mean are you trying to jump. Of course a country like Jaban will be much better prepared for a war then us, I AGREE. Actually, last year, I studied the entire recent economical and political stability in Jaban. I appreciate when somebody go widely and globally but he/she should exactly understand the science of processing.

4) ‘......sorry if its too long...i do hope that i did not get out of the subject.
thank u & salaamz....”

No problem but you went miles away from the subject and so did I (I guess)

5) This one is from another topic of yours but it relates to our discussions here..

“.....It wasn't till recently ( few yrs ago) when they realised "hey, i have to do something about it"..now mashallah u see omanis working in small shops, petrol stations. Thats good, bcz it shows acceptance...why can't we speed up the process and save us a good deal of precious time and.....”

See what I meant! I didn't mean that we should wait for a war to wake us up but certainly face forwards not backwards. You can’t tell Omanis to look at Jaban to realize that they should change but the current situation in Oman is changing them and they only need to look around. I think it is a simple humans behavior that they don't wake up until they have to !!!

sorry, for any misunderstanding..,

Hello again nzwani, no probs....good to keep this going.

I know u think that i take things into "large scales" but i did not mean by that that we omanis can take that big leap and suddenly become like japanese (for example). After all, i don't agree with their lifestyle totally. But what i menat was that they had to learn it the hard way, surely we can learn the same thing without the need to go through that long painful process.
Yes, we r trying to get there, but can't we move quicker? i'm sure we can...cos i can't wait.

it sounds foolish making big comparissons and all, but hey, u know if u wanna reach the top, u gotta aim high, no matter how impossible or ridiculous it sounds, thats my theory.
So at least that way, u have planned for the worst case.

No abuse, but surely, someone has to know whos the boss.

Its true, the teaching system should take more reponisbilities and try to develop the child in what he/she likes or is talented in, rather than to force him/her into something they can't relate to or give them a spank or a detention whenever they don't get the numbers right !

we are a nation of criticism. We have to put ourselves down in order to get up. It doesn't help much huh. I think that we agree on the same things, but my emphasis on blaming the kids is stronger than yours. I suppose it just depends from which angle u look at it :) funny right !

Hi R.online, Hi nzwani
your disscousion was intresting and i wanted to give an opinion in this useful subject
i read all the comments and i notice something :)
R.online..
you were always compering our childern with other countries childern which was unfair comparising....that because our children and japanise, palastinian, indaina...etc childern lived in a different enviroment (safe+war)......
nzwani...
you were right when you said that panisionment is not a right way to follow to teach a child in the school
i will say something here....
these days school instade of blinding up the students skills and personality it distory them....and that was my theroy since i was in school...teachers always put us down telling us that we r useless which is the opisit tamamn....(i think the teacher were jelous)....and she was always give complimant to the students who are NOT OMANI and student who have........ unfortunatly.....until now i have anger in my heart for those teachers who never ever support us ...
never mind..eli fat maat...we have to see our future the next genaration
we should smile and give them our supporte and till the new genaration do your best and you will see what is the result will be
i hope that my point is clear :)

HAVE A NICE PEACFUL DAY :)

I will assume that Miss smiler's cool post is a termination to this rather fascinating dialogue :). heh, I am not fugitive but we really covered the focal point and even lost track in many occasions bearing in mind that integral fulfillment is awkward to be obtained.

cheers.

well .. when I read the great discussion between R.online and niwani I really didnt know what to add ..
well .. true u both have went away from teh actual topic but I am sure that it was a very open talk that opened alot of doors ..
Well I kind of agree with R.online about our kids being pempared.. true its teh parents who to be blamed for pemparing them .. but then when parents are harsh on them we call it child violence .. so actully its hard to decide what to do when u have kids , sure its something that I think of every day and worry will I be able to raise my kids to be independant but at the same time loved !!!
about teachers beating kids .. I my self suffered from it in my early stages of education .. when I was only in grade one .. thats in the early stages of kids development .. and its the time when teh kids mentalty are shaped .. so beating them might make kids who learn to be against teacher no matter they were good or not ..we make generations who learn to be violent since they early stages of thier lives..
I do suport spancking .. but in limits and also we should restrict it to only those bad behaviours that any other methods cant help stopping them ..
any way .. good job both of you and keep it up ..

Thanks.

The pleasure is mine arbprincess. its always nice to keep it live & active.

I kinda forgot about this thread bcz there was this time where it was almost impossible to access the site.

About what u said, i agree with u, after all, '7air el-umoor awsa6uha, i.e. within limits, wu 3aleki lamba :)

You know, why don't we have some sort of organisation for our children? like in the uk, they have something known as "young muslims". Maybe we could have something like that too. Keep them active...make them feel they too can do something for their society.

I also agree with what nizwani, and by the way, u changed ur signature,,sorry can't read it, what does it say?

just curious :)

take care all.

I like the Idea that R.Online has suggested.. about having an organization that deals with our childrens affairs and concrens and that help us ( future parents ) to solve our children's problems ..
Maybe we can start this organization thorugh teh sabla here and then form an actual real organization when we ahev enough members ..
heeeey I am talking to much as if I am going to have children in the very near future :D

nice step arbprncess. Believe it or not, but i was going to suggest the same but then thought "nahhh, maybe i'm being too optimistic....what can we possibly do"
But hey, congrats for having the courage to say so.

U see, when i start working and having my own family, i don't just want to work like a robot, just routine. Earn money, eat, sleep...i'd like to be active and give something to the community.

They r now omanis who volunteer to teach youngsters in the afternoons stuff like karate and other things. We sleep to much (and immediately after lunch!), i'm sure we can do better.

Ok, so now, how about improving this talk a little bit more and make suggestions to how we are going to have our hmm, what should we call it "youth club"..i don't know...any suggestions ppl?

I haven’t changed my signature but I added the previous two phrases (abyaat) and took the chance to make them available in Arabic after Admin has added the service. I am just wondering what brweser do you have because I can read my signature in Arabic by using Internet Explorer...are you using Netscape Navigator???

Any way, They are the last three abyaat taken from Abu Alqasim Alshabi’s brilliant of “Al7ayah” or The Life. The following hyper link should view “Al7ayah”


http://www.kubbar.com/index-arabic.htm

Very nice.

and yes, i use netscape, its kinda annoying, bcz i'd like to joing the arabic sabla too, but no chance (unless i had my own PC..now wouldn't that be handy!).

About our Youth thing..i am still wondering if any ppl have any other suggestions, i am serious about this...it is possible, and it would be more than gr8 hearing from u (even criticism is accepted).

ta :)

as I said befoore .. I agree of this youth orrganization as being a very good start to have a healthy society especaiyl in the future ... as u can see that the society is changing and its hard to control children's behaviours..
this karate and spoorts thing is an excellent idea .. I add to it that we should start teaching our youths ( and even us ) some of our traditional handicrafts.. if we and our children didnt care about them they will slowly disapear .. I think Omani women's association is dealing with some of these issue but I find it hard for them to work alone ..what do u think ?

Where r u R.Online ..
heey u left our club or what ? :) we are supposed to start it from here :)
ok let me propose this idea .. why dont we decide of soemone each week to bring an article about children's rising up .. and post it here in this topic .. and then each of us collect tis article later for our club ( when it is created) .. but let start it after I finish exams .. 20th of may ok :)
what do u think all ?????

yallah here is the topic back ..
I will register a name for ( Oman's kids Assosiation ) OKA IN Arabic : mo2asosat A6fal 3man ..
this post will bring an article from different magazines, articles, internet or anything that concerns kids raising up and try to disucss the issue in the Article ..
a pst each week should be posted and there should be a rules for ever want to sign for the membership of this assosiation ( for latter reffrence ) ..
there should be a secrtary who keeps the articles in a website that can upload files in the internet and also a hard copy .. ( better somone who is good in computers -- anyone want to volounteer?! )
I want your opinon about this R.online before I start doing anything since it was your Idea in the first place !

Originally posted by arbprnces
Where r u R.Online ..
heey u left our club or what ? :) we are supposed to start it from here :)
ok let me propose this idea .. why dont we decide of soemone each week to bring an article about children's rising up .. and post it here in this topic .. and then each of us collect tis article later for our club ( when it is created) .. but let start it after I finish exams .. 20th of may ok :)
what do u think all ?????


Wallah shukran arprncess for asking, i didn't think really i'll be noticed consdering i haven't been coming for a while. My exams finish by 23rd may, so inshallah i'll try but this is my last year, so i might get a bit busy the nxt 2 months...

AS for the suggestion u made, its a great idea...may i add that we are not only here to have a chat and forgot about it thinking that we have done our job. That wouldn't make us different from those who keep crying over the past "we used to be...."

let us change the chain hmm :)

Thanks everybody especially u arpprncess. Yallah muwafakeen wu id3oolna ba3ad.

Originally posted by arbprnces
yallah here is the topic back ..
I will register a name for ( Oman's kids Assosiation ) OKA IN Arabic : mo2asosat A6fal 3man ..
this post will bring an article from different magazines, articles, internet or anything that concerns kids raising up and try to disucss the issue in the Article ..
a pst each week should be posted and there should be a rules for ever want to sign for the membership of this assosiation ( for latter reffrence ) ..
there should be a secrtary who keeps the articles in a website that can upload files in the internet and also a hard copy .. ( better somone who is good in computers -- anyone want to volounteer?! )
I want your opinon about this R.online before I start doing anything since it was your Idea in the first place !

Wallah its a great idea. So are u suggesting to make a website on this?

you know, if this is successful..then it could expand to something bigger. We could have things where omani kids could do on the site. I would like to volunteer...but mind u, i'll be a bit "on and about" for the nxt month...

wow, i'm already excited about this. Ok, lets do it...but we need to have a very good plan before even trying to start anything. So this is our project, and so we shall require a project manager. Hmm, care to be one arprncess?

a web designer, a journalist...etc. Actually, anybody can do it..just a bit of commitment & effort.

ok...i have to go now...but i'll be back.